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August 1, 2013

Pitt Football Q&A

Filed under: Coaches,Football,Players — Justin @ 1:37 pm

To break up all of the Chapman discussion, I posted a comment to see if anyone had any ideas for some different talking points and it kind of evolved into a Q&A session about a cornucopia of topics. If I missed your question, sorry, once I got close to 1500 words I had to edit so I could get back to my day job. If you see any glaring errors, my apologies.

Upittbaseball asked about the “[p]ro’s and Con’s of Heinz Field as the Panthers Home. The biggest CON is that the opponents are more excited to play there as it is usually the only time in their careers most will get to suit up in a NFL stadium.”

There was a story that came out during the ACC media days regarding Devin Street’s opinion of playing at Heinz Field. Basically, he said the team is more pumped to play on the road than at home because playing at Heinz feels a little awkward. I agree. It’s not their home, per se. There’s a reason Las Vegas generally gives a home team 3 points towards the spread: home teams have an advantage.

If the team doesn’t feel at home at Heinz, it definitely negates that advantage. There’s almost an innate instinct to “protect your turf.” I feel that is the biggest con of Heinz Field: the players don’t have a strong urge to protect it. Granted, poor fan turnout has to be a huge influence on that.

The biggest pro is that we do play at a top notch stadium. If you’ve ever visited other stadiums, you’ll see that Heinz is a hell of a lot nicer than most. We have more seating capacity than comparable programs (5th in the ACC, will be 4th if/when expansion is done). On top of that, it is a great recruiting tool initially. While the team may not feel at home, playing on the same field as the Steelers has to be better than playing at Carter Finley Stadium (NC State) or Byrd Stadium (Maryland).

The on campus stadium issue has been discussed ad naseum and I don’t want to get into that. Obviously everyone would prefer a gorgeous on campus stadium with easy highway access and plenty of parking lots to tailgate in. The question is practicality, and unless one of yinz is a billionaire, we won’t see one soon.

EMel asked “what’s our RB situation going to look like beyond Sir Isaac and Malcolm on the Move ??”

I know it has been stated that there’s a RB competition, but I fail to see how Isaac Bennett is not the starter unless James Conner or Rachid Ibrahim blows him away in camp. The job is Bennett’s to lose and I have high hopes for him (1,200 yards, double digit touchdowns). Bennett was a state champion long jumper in Texas and  is possibly the fastest RB in a straight line that we’ve had recently. He ran a sub 11 second 100m dash in high school.

The real question is who will get carries when Bennett is off the field? Malcolm Crockett would seem to be the logical choice as the most experienced RB, but take note of what I said in the spring under what I didn’t like:

Malcolm Crockett’s fumble. He had two hands on it yet it was stripped way too easily. Desmond Brown took a lot of 2nd team reps after that and I don’t think that was a coincidence. A RB who fumbles is a RB who stays on the bench. Desmond Brown looked good in the spring game, but there’s a big hole for James Conner to get a fair share of carries this fall.

 I think (and I believe I’ve seen Reed say the same) Desmond Brown has passed Crockett on the depth chart and is current in the lead for the most carries when Bennett comes off. There’s still a lot of room for James Conner and Rachid Ibrahim. I mentioned on twitter a few weeks back that Ibrahim introduced himself as a RB, not as a DB where it looked like he was initially headed.

The plan is most likely to start off Conner and Ibrahim at RB. If either of them make the top 3, they’ll stay at RB. If not, one or both can play defense (Conner would go to DE). From there, it’s a competition. If I were a betting man, I’d say 70% of the carries will go to Bennett, 20% to Brown, and 10% to Conner. Conner will mostly see short yardage (he’s 6’2 232 according to Yahoo) with his size and I’d hate to be on the receiving end of him running at full speed.

raypgh asked “what positions do you see real competition for starting jobs and/or significant playing time for some backups?”

The biggest position battle at the moment is for the RT spot. TJ Clemmings moved over from DL to OT this offseason but he’ll face a fierce competition from true freshman Dorian Johnson. I can’t express how important it is for the winner to play well.

We’re essentially going to have 5 new starters on the OL. Matt Rotheram started 12 games at RT and is sliding into RG. Cory King is going from LT to LG. RS freshman Adam Bisnowaty is starting at LT, Gabe Roberts appears to be the man at Center. If we get good play at RT from Clemmings or Johnson and the rest of the guys meet expectations, we’ll have the best OL we’ve had in a few years. Even better, only King is a senior, meaning we’ll have 4 of 5 starters back next year.

The second key battle is the offensive weapon across from Devin Street. I say offensive weapon, because it doesn’t have to be a WR, it could be TE/WR Manasseh Garner. Street is the #1 guy at WR and JP Holtz is at TE. I expect a lot of formation variation so guys like Scott Orndoff will see playing time. But if we’re in I-Form (2 WR, 1 RB, 1 FB, 1 TE) who’s across from Street?

Right now, the battle is between Garner, freshman Tyler Boyd, and senior Ed Tinker. I’m high on Boyd, but I think some Pitt fans are jumping the gun a little when they pencil him in as a starter at WR. He’s a talented guy who I expect to have a great career, but 40-50 snaps a game immediately? I’m not sure that’s going to happen. I predict we’ll see Boyd get 10-15 snaps per game early on unless he blows everyone away at camp. As the season progresses, we’ll see more. For the first few games, we’ll see a lot of Ed Tinker and Manasseh Garner. I’m very interested to see how they work Garner into the lineup with his skill set. I bet we’ll see a lot of him in Ace packages (2 TEs, 2 WRs, 1 RB) either in line or flexed out into the Y position (slot WR essentially).

Caw Miller asked “one thing I’ve always felt was that Pitt started slow, looked sloppy when they had cupcakes early on the schedule. Once they played a real team, and lost, Pitt toughened up and played better. Can you look into that?”

I think a lot of that has to do with team experience. I’d say the most experienced team we’ve had since Wannstache became coach was the 2009 squad. Take a look at that team’s roster. We had senior leaders like Nate Byham, Gus Mustakus, and John Malecki. There were juniors like Jason Pinkston, Dom DeCicco, and Greg Romeus. These were guys you could trust to do their jobs and lead by example. We were able to usher in a true freshman RB because we had a senior at QB, an experienced OL, 2 seniors at TE, and an immensely talented deep threat in Jon Baldwin.

The DL had multiple NFL level players that eased the burden off of a less talented LB corps that was loaded with upper classmen. The problem we’ve had is that there has been so much turmoil and change over the past 8 or 9 years that it took until 2008 for us to field a somewhat complete squad and that only lasted 3 years.

To round it all out, you need the team properly set up to avoid a slow start. A slow start is often a product of a lot of new starters or a new scheme (which is most years sadly). Thankfully the defense is returning a lot of starters to make up for what is essentially 2 or 3 starters playing the same spot on offense (WR, TE, and maybe FB). If the defense plays like they did against Virginia Tech, Notre Dame, and Rutgers, it’ll give the offense time to get on their feet by the time Virginia comes to town.





The main problem with heinz is that is a dump. It is the worst stadium I have ever been in for watching the game.
The only good seats are club level.
The Rooney’s cut every corner and left pitt holding the bag. If the stadium was not such a cheap piece of crap it would not be as big of a problem.

Comment by Kevin 08.01.13 @ 1:53 pm

No doubt the sightlines suck compared to a bowl stadium. As uncomfortable Pitt Stadium seating was, it still was great for watching a game.

AS far as receiving weapons … look for a lot of double TE sets with Holtz and Garner. Heard a radio interview recently with QBs Savage and Voytik, and they were asked what player may surprise Pitt fans with a breakout year … and Savage immediately replied “Manasseh Garner” .. so if the QB says that, it means he has faith in him.

Justin, can’t agree with you more about the impact of experience has at the beginning of the season … seen it happen many times.

Comment by wbb 08.01.13 @ 2:07 pm

Kevin,

All stadiums are dumpy anymore..20 yr life expectancy, if that.

CHEAP CHEAP CHEAP. Biz model in construction (nowadays) is for the GC to WAY underbid the package and essentially back into a profit by value engineering.

Ok, rant is over.

Boyd will need a lot of practice before jumping into a #2WR spot in the ACC, plain and simple…should add 20lbs too.

Comment by Yup 08.01.13 @ 2:15 pm

How about using that ACC money to put a half-decent Pitt logo in the center of the field.

How about making the two ACC logos that go at each 20 yard line beautiful blue&gold logos, and not some chalk outline that will get muddied up by the end of the 1st quarter.

Actually, maybe I’ve jumped ahead too far, maybe they’re not even going to bother with the ACC logos.

You could throw in making the Pittsburgh in the one end zone outlined in blue, instead of black.

Ya, I know, it cost too much, it’s too difficult to do, they’d have to make special arrangements with the Steelers etc. etc. etc.

At least it would look like a college field.

I know, I’m asking for the moon.

Comment by Dan 08.01.13 @ 3:03 pm

If the Big 33 was any kind of indication at all, don’t think Boyd will need that much practice time.

This kid is quite the athlete. Also a very good defensive player and just dominated the Quad A stars of BOTH PA & Maryland. I believe he also can hoop.

And he’s 180 lbs which is big enough to play on the outside, which is where you want to get him…

…….In Space…..with the ball.

I think he’s going to be the most exciting player at Pitt since Fitz !

PC should have a field day, moving him around to find the matchup that will provide maximum dividends for Pitt & Boyd.

Let’s Go Pitt !

Comment by EMel 08.01.13 @ 3:04 pm

When it comes to player expectations, I always want to be wrong on the low side. Nothing would make me happier than for Boyd to have a freshman all american type season. All I want is for Pitt to win games without being too dirty. Criminals on the field? No. Players whose palms are greased to come here? Victimless crime.

Comment by Justin 08.01.13 @ 3:08 pm

@ Dan-o

I’m sold buddy. You’re officially in charge of directing communications towards Smiley to make sure the Field looks good ! 🙂

Hopefully you also know one of the Rooney’s too.
Or someone that does.

Surely it can’t be that big of a deal to get a quality looking PITT at mid-field. We do pay rent or whatever to play in Heinz.

Unless the GD greenskeeper at Heinz is a Ped State fan or worse/better?….a Hoopie !

Comment by EMel 08.01.13 @ 3:11 pm

Does ACC money have anuthing to do what logos the Heinz Field has? I thought since it was used by both Pitt and Steelers, logoss were used at a minimum, if at all.

You may remember that the endzones usually have just those slanted stripes inone, and ‘PITTSBURGH” in the other. And there is not even the Stiller logo in middle of the field until Pitt’s season is over.

Comment by wbb 08.01.13 @ 3:21 pm

I’ll settle for Boyd being most exciting since Shady.

Comment by wbb 08.01.13 @ 3:22 pm

Boyd is a playmaker.
However, he is only 170# at 6’1″.
He never played WR in HS so I doubt he will beat out anyone for a starting position.
That said, I do believe he will be in there for specific plays, perhaps at RB for pass play or slot receiver. I hope he put some weight on this summer otherwise he may be RS.

Comment by Pitt.Dan83 08.01.13 @ 3:30 pm

Copied from the previous thread:
I’m high on this guy from McDowell HS, James Conner in this incoming Freshman class. This is a kid with the size to be the kind of running back that Pitt hasn’t had for DECADES. At 6’4? and 235lbs he still has quickness.

Conner only really played exclusively as a running back just last year and totally blew the lid off! His stats for the season were 1,680yds on just 115 carries. If you’re not good with numbers that is 14.5yds/carry and that produced 21 rushing TDs. He added another 4 TDs through the air.

This kid was a sleeper recruit, since he changed positions his senior year to the RB position. Watch his game video against State College HS on a slick field and tell me that he doesn’t look like a man amoungst boys in that game!

link to youtube.com

I expect to see him on the field this season.

My question is when does Kevin Weatherspoon decide to live up to his expectations coming out of Clairton? I see him giving Ed Tinker a run for his money, SOMEBODY needs to step up and take control of the WR position or else Devin better get used to the free safety double coverage defenses that are going to be all over him on deep routes.

Comment by Dr. Tom 08.01.13 @ 3:31 pm

I love the stripe lines in the endzone. I’ve seen nicer endzone’s at the 7th grade level. I agree Heinz is a dump. I just think the other teams get amped b/c it’s a NFL stadium and our kids don’t like it and the fans can’t stand it.

Comment by Upittbaseball 08.01.13 @ 3:39 pm

Well, a current player agrees with the majority of players surveyed back in 1998 about playing off campus. Of course, Stevie never talks to players who how would he know??

Comment by TonyinHouston 08.01.13 @ 3:47 pm

You tube link didn’t copy and paste: link to youtube.com

Comment by Dr. Tom 08.01.13 @ 3:52 pm

@@@@@@
Logos on the 50 yard line, colorful
end zones, etc. are nice to have. However
Heinz Field is not a dump. Travel to
Atlanta and watch a game at Georgia Tech.
That stadium is a dump. Heinz Field
is not perfect. What is? Just win
football games, be competitive, beat
teams that are ranked higher, etc. Then
all of this noise will be moot.

Comment by JR 08.01.13 @ 3:56 pm

Has any group looked at the Almono site along the Mon River for a new Pitt stadium? That’s very close to campus and has great on-off capability.

Comment by Palm Beach Panther 08.01.13 @ 4:06 pm

@Palm Beach…

link to almono.org

I think some folks already have their group attachments and ideas for the site. Certainly plenty of space, but still a bus ride for the students and just like Heinz, not a lot to do before and after a game (unless heavy drinking and not driving involved).

Comment by CompLit 08.01.13 @ 4:40 pm

OK, here’s another question for Justin, what’s the status of Bam Bradley? Rumors of him leaving the team in the past if I remember correctly.

Comment by Dr. Tom 08.01.13 @ 4:51 pm

I believe that Pitt should seriously start looking at a new stadium. Set up a committee and a fund raising account. It may take years but start.

Look at innovative designs similar to the Petersen Events Center and PNC Park. Something to catch the media’s eye. Showcase the Cathedral.

Comment by Frank MD 08.01.13 @ 4:55 pm

Trib reporting 3 Pitt wrestlers suspended indefinitely for getting in a fight outside PNC park.

link to triblive.com

Comment by Pitt.Dan83 08.01.13 @ 4:58 pm

@ Frank MD

You mean something like this?

link to panther-hollow.org

Comment by CompLit 08.01.13 @ 5:53 pm

Well, i’d think it would come down to money, and since we have more from the ACC, it should be able to be done.

They would have to get some good field painters. I’m assuming there are companies that do this, because I see it other places.

The money would come in, because they would have to come in right after the game, take it off, then put it back on next game. Sure, it would be an expense. Running a business takes spending money some times.

Yes, the Steelers gave 57 million, and Heinz 21 million in naming rights. Guess what, it cost 282 million to build.

Guess where that other 204 million came from?? The 7 county area, aka, the taxpayers.

I get that the Steelers dominate it. However, someone with some balls and an in your face, we’re gonna do this attitude should be able to get it done. (or have gotten it done). Especially with the taxpayers owning the stadium, at least over 2/3rds of it.

I’m just saying, in this day and age, and with the dynamic, progressive, high energy, gurus, top of their field, forward thinking, ahead of the curve, staying out in front of it leadership we have at Pitt……….

we could at least get a decent looking logo on the field, especially for tv games.

Not even bitchin about the stadium, where it’s at, or the sight lines. (my seats are actually excellent for viewing the game).

No, nothin’???

And if we agreed to that years ago to have few or no markings, who signed off on that????

Someone that went into the meetings with a “golly gee Wally, we’re just happy you’re letting us play here attitude”. Who was that??

I don’t say this lightly. I seriously believe, just a few adjustments to the field, would give the place more of a college feel, more of a home field advantage.

I can speak clearly, hear clearly, and see clearly to my brother and nieces in California on my Iphone facetime, in less than 3 or 4 seconds, and carry on a conversation like they are sitting next to me, but…..

we can’t have a nice “Pitt” or a friggin’ blue and gold Panther paw on a football field????

Comment by Dan 08.01.13 @ 6:02 pm

P.S. I’m a Steeler fan too. The Rooneys really blow it for the Steelers too, with that dump of a field they allow them to play on.

Continually ranked as the very worst, and at least always in the bottom 3 of playing surfaces by the NFL players themselves.

If they’d get with the times, and get a (insert word here, I can’t think of it ((part grass, part turf)) field. They could have nice Steeler logos, nice Pitt logos, and even nice high school logos, as those fields can have different pieces inserted into them.

You got a 300 million dollar stadium and the teams play on a cow pasture. Un****** believable.

Comment by Dan 08.01.13 @ 6:10 pm

well if someone signed off on it … I will give you 1 guess

Comment by wbb 08.01.13 @ 6:11 pm

Good start CompLit. I would hope it done while I am still here.

Comment by Frank MD 08.01.13 @ 6:19 pm

Georgia Tech’s stadium is awesome and is next to bars and dorms and in a city. It’s great atmosphere. Not a corporate shell with no personality like Heinz.

link to ramblinwreck.com

Comment by Upittbaseball 08.01.13 @ 6:43 pm

Justin, you didn’t mention Juantez Hollins or Ryan Schlieper two seniors who have some experience. Should provide quality depth if they aren’t starters.

Heinz Field will be a lot better if it ever gets to standing room only. It does suck with 20,000 quiet fans.

When we get a quality product on the field, they will come. Look at the Buccos.

Comment by gc 08.01.13 @ 6:54 pm

Dr. Tom

There have been plenty of rumors that Bradley and Grigsby are transferring, but I haven’t seen anything regarding paperwork being filed. A known insider on the Rivals board, pitt1848, said on the premium board there’s going to be more turnover than expected this offseason.

Comment by Justin 08.01.13 @ 7:22 pm

A perfect college stadium could be built in the future on campus…see the site pointed out by CompLit, but as Justin said, it would take some dough. Might as well begin a feasibility study though so the new Chancellor can prioritize capital projects. Imagine what Heinz will look like in another 15 years and then the Steeler ownership decides to replace the dump and build a new modern and high tech viewing experience in the burbs. Heinz is too big, too corporate, too sterile and yes too many amenities for the college experience. Wouldn’t it be great if Pitt had a rockin stadium like Oregons except on a smaller scale. They engineered that stadium to amplify the noise. Talk about a home field advantage.

Comment by TX Panther 08.01.13 @ 8:21 pm

I think that Pitt should build a 55,000 seat domed stadium on or near the campus. On open air stadium is too limited for use by the weather in Pittsburgh to justify the expense of building it. A domed stadium could be used year round for concerts and other stadium events (dare I say an NCAA Final Four?). Perhaps it could also be used for track and baseball.

Comment by HbgFrank 08.01.13 @ 9:11 pm

how about steven kings dome

Comment by paul shannon 08.01.13 @ 9:18 pm

A retractable dome would be nice but an expensive add on. If the money can be found, I say explore the design idea, but just make sure there is tall high glass on the north end to view TD Cathedral. That would put the max seating capacity at 50k assuming the south end of the stadium offsets the loss of some seating with a higher elevation, hence, the roof would have a pitch. Noise would be incredible. And weather would never be an excuse.

Comment by TX Panther 08.01.13 @ 9:41 pm

@gc, you are right.

As much as I liked Pitt Stadium, want a new stadium on campus and all the reasons we’ve all mentioned, I’m just trying to think of ways to make Heinz more homey.

Not just being negative. Trying to be positive.

I think they’ve tried, with the retired numbers up. The blue and gold at the base of the seats wrapping around all the way.

I know it seems minor, but my rant above about a large, clear logo at midfield, and beautiful blue and gold ACC logos, will catch a lot of eyes.

Afterall, most of your time at the game, and certainly most on tv, your eyes are on the field.

So, as much as I hate us playing at a professional stadium, in the mean time, I think something that many would think is just a stupid little thing, could make a world of difference.

It’s funny, as much as I liked Pitt Stadium, wish for a new stadium on campus for the students and alumni to have the game day experience……

I really don’t “hate” Heinz Field.

I know the Steelers run it. But, Labor Day night, national tv, only game in town and on the tube, the field should be looking sharp.

p.s. If some don’t know what I’m talking about when I mention the ACC logos…..

All of the ACC teams, have ACC logos at each of their 20 yard lines. It identifies the league, and that you are part of the league.

The logo is quite simple, and is standard at all teams stadiums, and they all use the same logo. What they do though, that is different, is they make the logo the schools colors.

It’s kind of a nice logo, and really does scream out “we’re part of something”. They’re a nice size, you can’t miss them.

ex. N. Carolina’s are powder blue and white, Va.Tech’s is orange an maroon etc. etc..

Actually kinda cool.

My fear is that instead of beautiful blue and gold ACC logos, screaming out “ACC”. We’re gonna get high school chalk that will be gone 5 minutes into the game, or, perhaps they won’t even bother.

We moved to a pro stadium, we don’t have an on campus stadium, I’m willing to make due with what we have for now, but there has got to be a way to at least dress up the field for 6 or 7 Saturdays a year.

Of course, how the team plays is #1. Some WVU games, some ND games and the Cincinnati game were fantastic.

You are right, if you get over 50K in there, or even sell outs, the atmosphere can be good.

Comment by Dan 08.01.13 @ 9:53 pm

Hey, I mentioned I was listening to a College Football show on satellite radio this week, had a very long road trip.

I guess they revamped U of Washington’s stadium. Suppose to be fantastic.

They took the track around the field out. Moved the seats down to field level. Guess they redid the seats and press boxes too, put some luxury ones in.

Suppose to be a real jewel. They already have a great setting on Lake Washington and Puget Sound.

Had their coach on, Steve Sarkashian (sp?). He actually takes a boat to work. His house in on Puget Sound, and literally gets in a boat, and pulls up to the stadium.

Spectacular they say.

I remember Pitt had a home and home with them, maybe 78-79?? Early 80’s. Both top ten teams then. Beat them both times.

Randy McMillan I remember had a huge day up in Seattle!! Maybe over 200 yards rushing.

He was a good ball player.

Comment by Dan 08.01.13 @ 10:03 pm

My God people. Get over Pitt stadium. It was a shit hole. The track made the seats too far from the field. The infrastructure was I an embarrassment. The only thing wrong with Heinz is the upper deck which Pitt fans do not fill. Like many have said. Just win.

Comment by notrocketscience 08.01.13 @ 10:14 pm

For all the talk about Heinz Field being a piece of crap – it has saved our asses as far as getting us wins.

From my 3:00 am calculations I see, since 2005, a 36-15 record at Heinz as a home field advantage. Street’s comments aside that means something as we were no where near that winning percentage overall.

An on campus stadium just isn’t ever going to happen my friends.

Comment by Reed 08.02.13 @ 2:23 am

notrocketscience, I agree it was a S-hole but still would rather watch a FB game from old Pitt Stadium than Heinz. As a lifelong Pittsburgh fan, I cannot tell you how disappointed I was with Heinz … no comparison at all to PNC Park, which is really a great ballpark, and acknowledged as one of the best in MLB by most.

While the Great Hall is nice, the first and lasting impression was all of this tackly yellow seats. The dark navy seats at PNC are so much more appealing.

I am not as appalled by the move to Heinz as most of you are and think it is a better location logistically than the Stadium (except for the students of course), but I agree that a 50-55k stadium near the river with easier access than Oakland would be the optimal solution for Pitt

Comment by wbb 08.02.13 @ 6:22 am

BTW, Pitt’s best season attendance records were at Heinz …. as I recall even in the late 70s, you can always walk up for tickets unless the opponent was PSU, ND or WVU

Comment by wbb 08.02.13 @ 6:25 am

Does anyone have an email for the Oakland Zoo coordinator? I have an idea to make the zoo more panther.

Comment by Caw Miller 08.02.13 @ 6:27 am

Reed, you of all people should realize that the words NEVER and EVER should never be used, (oops, I mean shouldn’t be used) as a statement of fact. An on campus stadium could happen. The ACC money and exposure could be a game changer for Pitt football going forward, who really knows? But for sure, it isn’t going to materialize in the next few years.

So in the meantime to make Heinz Field feel a little more “homey” I would suggest replacing those ugly yellow seats with Lazy Boy Recliners. Not only would they be comfy, just like in my man cave but it would reduce the seating capacity by 20,000 or so, (to permit room for FULL reclining). The majority of the old fart Pitt fans would love that, since they never stand up in the first place to root their team on.

Please start Fall camp so we can focus on some truly relevant topics to debate about.

Comment by Dr. Tom 08.02.13 @ 8:36 am

Hit up JD on twitter. He’s gone but he’ll know who to send it to. link to twitter.com

Comment by Justin 08.02.13 @ 8:47 am

While I would love to have on on campus stadium, it’s never going to happen. There will be no public funding for stadiums in Pittsburgh for at least a generation. I know of no alumni billionaires that would pick up the tab. Real estate in Oakland is through the roof. Parking is problematic.

Pitt cannot threaten to leave town like the Steelers or Pirates.

It’s a sweet dream, but nothing more. There just aren’t enough Pitt Fans to support such a project.

I agree with all of the deficiencies mentioned about Heinz, but it is what it is.

We need to make it more Pitt-centric. How about a number of statues, Jock Sutherland, Tony Dorsett, Dan Marino, Hugh Green, Iron Mike etc. How about a Pitt Club, with memorabilia and activities before and after games and a big screen for away games.

Pitt Fans need to make Heinz Field into Pitt Stadium on Saturdays. The biggest problem is the lack of positive memories. We need some big wins. The tacky yellow seats will feel more inviting with some better memories. If that doesn’t work we could always try blue seat covers.

Comment by gc 08.02.13 @ 8:55 am

Heinz field is a nice stadium except the upper deck which is freaking dangerous. Especially after a few beers.
I would love to see Pitt have a smaller stadium, even if it wasn’t on campus but I agree it won’t happen any time soon.

Comment by notrocketscience 08.02.13 @ 9:06 am

To Upottbaseball

Regarding GT’s stadium so it is next
to a high crime area, the bleachers and
top level of the structure shake when
people stand, and walking to a seat
in the upper level gives most people
vertigo. It is a dump and seats are always
a available for 2’bucks.

Comment by JR 08.02.13 @ 9:12 am

The upper deck is half the stadium. The open end kills all the noise. The Steelers don’t really get an edge and it is filled.
The visiting QB calling plays like it is practice.
It is a dump. Former season ticket holder Steelers, season ticket holder Pitt.
The seats I got after the move from 3 rivers were so bad I could not watch the game.

Comment by kman 08.02.13 @ 9:42 am

Yes, its nice to have an urban university with an on campus stadium like Cincinnati and Ga Tech. Both of those were built 100 years ago before the city grew around them. Pitt had a venue like that and decided to re-purpose it.

As much as I love the Panther Hollow idea, I just cant see it happening. It makes too much sense, and stuff like that never ends up happening… It would be interesting if a fund raising effort ever got moving…. CompLit, have you had any success with the pantherhollow.org website?

Comment by BostonsCommon 08.02.13 @ 9:48 am

@BostonsCommon..

We have had some success and some things are in the works over the next month. Stay tuned as TX_Panther & I will keep you posted.

Comment by CompLit 08.02.13 @ 9:56 am

Dr. T – unfortunately I do think in absolutes when it comes to an on-campus stadium ever being built. The North Oakland and surrounding neighborhoods have changed so much, specifically the great increases in property values and in per capita income, that no one living anywhere close to wherever PITT could find land to put in a stadium would buy off on it.

I grew up right at the border of Oakland, Shadyside and Squirrel Hill and still visit often. There is a ton of ‘Big Money’ in the area between Oakland and Shadyside in particular and those homeowners are not going to put up with all the problems a football stadium had before and would bring again.

When PITT built the stadium in 1938 PITT was a much smaller school and the surrounding areas were regular neighborhoods – not the big priced ‘destination’ places to live that they became in the 1960s onward. In early Pittsburgh history the big money lived pretty far down Fifth Avenue but that changed and that tri-neighborhood area became the places to live if one had money but didn’t want to live in the new suburbs. I’m talking about the area inside the borders of Baum Blvd, Center Ave, Penn Ave and Wilkins Ave. A new stadium would bring nothing positive to them and they won’t go for headaches it would incur.

Also, forget about any parkland being used, that is completely off the board and etched in stone. I grew up with the President of the Pittsburgh Parks Conservatory (PPC) and know for a fact that will never happen. The PPC is one of the most powerful entities in PGH, be it public or private.

I know this sound very snotty and it is, but we have to remember that unlike most urban campuses, that are mostly located in low income areas, PITT is smack dab in some of the most prime real estate in PA. Granted that south Oakland is crappy but that is changing and will continue to change as long as the student population and the real estate needs of the University keep growing, and those have no indications of stopping at all.

PITT is no longer the commuter college that it was when football was played on campus – there were few needs for dorms and supporting logistical buildings back then because the vast majority of the students didn’t live on campus, very few actually. PITT’s relationship with the homeowners there, and in truth between other bordering neighborhoods, is already on shaky ground. A proposed stadium there would be volcano waiting to erupt.

The area between PITT and the downtown area is undergoing very positive changes and that land is becoming increasingly more valuable also. People are moving not only back into PGH but want to live in the Downtown PGH area. The business of residential building in the downtown area is really booming and expansion is already moving up Fifth Ave towards the PITT campus. There just isn’t any land in any direction from the center of the PITT campus that isn’t already too valuable, or becoming too valuable, for a stadium to be placed there.

PITT has many other pressing land needs other than a football stadium. I believe that PITT fans are pretty much engaged in wishful thinking that PITT will ever put any more emphasis on this issue than it will in any other mission areas of the university. The fact that we are now in the ACC is not a game changer for this either, the subject goes way beyond even the university itself.

I think the best shot PITT has for this is to build a stadium away from the immediate campus, I thought the Hazelwood LTV site would have been perfect, and thus extend the campus foot print into a new area. PITT could have snapped that up 10 years ago for a pittance compared to what it sold for two years ago. In reality, anywhere PITT locates a new stadium automatically becomes part of the campus.

The bottom line is that the citizens and the government of PGH and the surrounding areas are not invested at all in the prospect of PITT building a new football stadium. I believe quite the opposite is true. A new stadium located on or adjoining the current campus footprint wouldn’t bring nearly the real estate tax money that residences will.

My God – PITT has been lobbying for years to close off one single block of Bigelow Blvd between the Cathedral & the Student Union and the city is adamant that it not happen… and we think they will buy off on a stadium being built with the infrastructure and displacements that would bring? Fat chance and forget about any imminent domain attempts either, that will never happen for a project that serves no one but PITT.

It just doesn’t even matter one bit to anyone but some alumni who want to recapture the memories of watching a game on campus. I believe the PITT administration feels the same way also. They committed to a long term deal with Heinz Field and tore down PITT stadium for just the above reasons – that they feel that any land in the immediate area needed to be used to expand the University’s student, academic and research.

Comment by Reed 08.02.13 @ 9:56 am

The alleged on-campus stadium badly needs a sponsor, and only the alleged non-profit UPMC can come to the rescue. Jonas Salk Field at UPMC Stadium.

UPMC is the largest employer in Western PA, with 22 hospitals reaching all the way north to Erie. It makes annual (non) profits of multi-millions … and it can be a showcase for state-of-the art fitness, sports medicine, physical therapy, etc

Comment by wbb 08.02.13 @ 9:59 am

I couldn’t possibly imagine 40k people driving into Oakland on a saturday these days. That sounds like a traffic nightmare worse than headed outbound through the squirrel hill tunnels with one lane closed.

Comment by Justin 08.02.13 @ 10:09 am

wbb, I doubt UPMC wants to drop a few hundred on a stadium for us unless it gets the city off of their back for taxes. They’ll just keep buying up real estate and abusing their non profit status and be merry.

Comment by Justin 08.02.13 @ 10:11 am

what we liked about pitt stadium was its charm. tailgating at the Syria Mosque walking up the hill that felt flat because the entire herd of people were so excited to watch some great great teams. The iconic view of the campus from the top, etc. I am all for an on campus facility & have gone over the panther hollow concept (although some time ago). I love the concept but cant see how to fit it into forbes avenue where we have one historic landmark after the other in every direction. Im no city planner but why couldn’t admin implode trees and the field house and build a 50k seat domed multi purpose facility with new swimming/diving area off the back or something??? Access is great, it would be a shot in the arm for the Hill District and wouldnt interrupt university & hospital traffic a ton? Raising cash is the ez part me thinks

Comment by ptbreezeb 08.02.13 @ 11:57 am

The big opportunity to continue to have an ‘On-Campus’ football stadium might have been lost when they decided to replace Pitt Stadium with only a new basketball venue.

That was a very short-sighted decision. If you were going to tear down Pitt Stadium, plans should have been on the table to replace it with a New Pitt Stadium that also could house basketball games. But of course that was smack dab in the middle of Cornhole deconstructing the Pitt name OUT of the university vernacular.

Pitt basketball could have been played at the Civic Arena and of course football at Heinz until the new multi-sport stadium/arena was finished.

What a waste of space that exists behind The Pete.
A sorry state of a place that once housed some of the greatest college football players and teams in college football history. A University where ONLY football has EVER won a National Championship in ANY sport(not counting Ultimate Frisbee). And furthermore claims 9 total National Championships, yet doesn’t have a campus stadium. The absurdity level with this is way over the top.

Much more than the coaching hire fumblings and the overall poor state of university sports teams (see Directors Cup), the absurd rebranding of Pitt into Pittsburgh, the groundhog helmet decal instead of script ‘Pitt’ on the helmet, this is what Pederson’s legacy at Pitt will be remembered for……

…..the destruction of a on-campus football stadium with NO Plans to replace it !

Comment by EMel 08.02.13 @ 11:59 am

oh, Reed well said. We grew up in the same part of town & you nailed it! Well stated

Comment by ptbreezeb 08.02.13 @ 12:01 pm

When you say multi-purpose, multi-sport facility that could house baseketball and football, and Olympic sports…. You don’t mean the Carrier Dome do you?

I’ve never been there, but I’ve always wondered what it would be like watching basketball games from a football seat. You’re just so far away. Almost like trying to play hockey games at football stadiums. It’s a great idea, but the outcome leaves a lot to be desired.

Comment by BostonsCommon 08.02.13 @ 12:27 pm

Well there is now a non university sponsored plan to replace Heinz when it outlives its life in about another 15 years. The plans on being drawn up on the site that CompLit mentions. The purpose is to ascertain the feasibility of a multi purpose facility on one end of the Hollow. More than just a football stadium. More than just a Pitt thing. Ambitious yes. A dream…yes for now. But some dreams actually do come true in time with enough money and partners supporting it. Never say never. Reed and Justin, the site addresses many of your concerns. There is no perfect solution but there are many acceptable options to several issues which you raised.

Comment by TX Panther 08.02.13 @ 12:37 pm

My definition of multi purpose is a place where people live, work and play. Dorms, classrooms, lecture halls, office and retail space, banquet rooms, light rail hub, football field for the college experience. That’s not to say the lacrosse or soccer teams couldn’t use it. Could maybe even be used for Pitt’s future D1 hockey team. Dare I dream.

Comment by TX Panther 08.02.13 @ 1:39 pm

Justin, I’ll guarantee UPMC won’t do it while in legislation with city … on the other hand, the area’s 4-letter giant seems to have creative ways of getting past the tax obligations and Presby is getting old

Comment by wbb 08.02.13 @ 2:09 pm

“Cornhole”, LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!

And used, not as a laugh or a jeer, but being used oft handedly as it were his actual name!!!

LMFAO!!!

Comment by Dan 08.02.13 @ 2:55 pm

Amen TX, amen & wbb raises an interesting point. I would argue one thing – Presby was old some time ago. “The Big House” is a bear of a facility to manage, fact. How this dove tails to a UPitt multi-purpose/campus life facility is beyond me though. The university would have to issue bonds, raise funds, the whole megilla on its own no? Why does it seem to me that everyone ignores the Trees Hall/Field House quadrant of Real Estate. Yet those buildings are well beyond their “useful lives”? As Reed demonstrates South & North Oakland are densely populated & Schenley Park is off limits, theres no where else to go. Take it up the hill (or go to Hazelwood). Yes to soccer, baseball, lax, olympic sports, et al. Keep the Pedersen for hoops, that milk is out of the bottle and the place rocks. I love the idea of the panther hollow plan. but ultimately it seems ambitious (I believe it calls for physically moving a historic landmark) and romantic (by virtue of its suggested location when considering Reeds points). Take it up the hill.

Comment by ptbreezeb 08.02.13 @ 3:05 pm

i know the spring game is just that, a spring game, but Kevin Weatherspoon and Manessah Garner were both very impressive. Have high hopes for the defense but still concerned that D Coordinator Matt House has never been a coordinator and other than a few years as a secondary coach, only other experience in college is one year as a DL coach. Also, the majority of the defensive staff is inexperienced. Hope he really leans on Palermo, especially early on

Comment by pap76 08.02.13 @ 3:46 pm

pap76, you’re gettin me excited. Gettin’ closer to go time!!!

I’m hopefull with the defense and the returning starters. Should help House get his feet wet having some experience out there.

Comment by Dan 08.02.13 @ 4:20 pm

The only spot that makes any sense is if we go north of centre around Wylie Street north of Cost Field. There’s plenty of cheaper real estate there, but it’s politically a nightmare because the communities there would have visions of the Civic Arena forcing minority relocation.

Comment by Justin 08.02.13 @ 5:57 pm

Well, I could see EMel’s idea but only if PITT built over the new sports complex that land is 350 yds x 164 yds; 229 yds if you built right up to Breckenridge on the north. Heinz Field’s footprint is 289 yds x 254 yds so the land would be there. There would still be the infrastructure problems though.

To accept parking spaces around the stadium PITT would have to to drastically downsize the stadium itself to maybe 35-40K seats, losing 25K from Heinz’s capacity, however say goodbye to the ACC if they do that.

Don’t get me wrong guys – I absolutely loved walking from Shadyside down Bayard Street with a belly full of Bloody Mary’s and chomping at the bit to watch at game at PITT stadium. Some of my best memories when I lived in PGH were doing that when I was a student back in the early-mid 1970s on those lovely fall afternoons.

Prior to that, when I was a kid, we would ‘tailgate’ at my Uncle’s labs in Presbyterian Hospital with beer and Coke in the sinks and hot dogs over the Bunsen Burners. So I loved being at PITT Stadium even though I’ll say that I left 20 years before it became more rundown.

I just don’t see the many and various stars aligning to ever replicate the type, size and capacity stadium anywhere on the Oakland campus any longer.

Comment by Reed 08.03.13 @ 8:36 am

Back to football:

I never really watched James Connor’s HS films but when I did this morning I was pretty shocked at just how good this kid was at RB. First off he is so much bigger than the LBs and DBs that it looks like there is no way he can get past and out run them but he seems to do it with ease. The fact that he did it against great competition makes it even better – give this kid a decent OL and a running mate like Bennett and we have our running game we need maybe.

link to youtube.com

He has those good lateral moves once past the LOS also, again it looks weird coming for a guy so tall and well-built. He reminds me of the great Eric Dickerson who was 6’3″ tall and just outran everyone. I’d like to see Connor get snaps early and often this season.

I might be the only PITT fan who is not at all sold on Clemmings at RT. I hope he does a great job of course but I believe that everyone’s expectations, including all the recruiting services, were way too high for this young man. I’m crossing my fingers it works out for him there but I’ll bet we see D. Johnson before long at RT.

Note: I didn’t say Brown was a solid RB2 yet but that he’s really impressed during spring practices then had 90 yards w/ a 5.0 YPC average in the spring game. He’s a rsSR who has been around the program for a long time so he’ll add some stability in that group.

Contrary to the published two deep and current chatter I don’t think Ray Vinopal is lock for the full time starter at Safety. I also am not nearly as down on him as others are. I think Vinopal is the type of player who may just blossom give starting responsibilities but we also have other talent there, Lewis and J. Pitts, who will give him a run for the position.

Comment by Reed 08.03.13 @ 9:19 am

@ Reed, Conner looks like the kind of RB that could make us forget about the loss of Shell pretty fast. The characteristic that I think is the best quality concerning his running style is that he runs with “purpose”. North-South, get the yards that are there while running people over in the process. I’m not sure how that style will carry over into the college game, but this kid has the size to give it a go with that technique if he continues to “bring it” like he has proven he can do successfully at the HS level.

Let us not forget Juantez Hollins and Ryan Schlieper regarding the depth available at the RT spot. Hollins is still on the team as far as I know and maybe the light goes on for him during his last RS Senior season after the year long riding the pine repremand suspension by Chryst last year. His potential is sky high IMO and if he is going to produce, this is his last chance to do so. Schlieper could end up as the RT starter himself if he is fully back from his injury. Actually, IF WE CAN STAY HEALTHY, on the OL, I think that we are going to be pretty solid up front this year.

Another incoming Freshman that is going to surprise a lot of Pitt fans regharding his immediate impact on the game will be Chris Blewitt. I said it back when he first committed to Pitt, this kid is going to be $$$$. He is from the Washington DC area so I got wind of him early in the recruiting process. He is very motivated to contribute early on in his career here at Pitt and as a kicker, he has the goods to do so right now. Not only will he give us the edge on FG attempts but I predict that he will end up being our sercret weapon on special teams this season. By that I mean, we can’t get burned with TDs on kickoffs with our $hitty runback coverages when the kickoff results in a touchback. Blewitt has the power in his leg to produce that kind of performance on a regular basis.

Lastly you mentioned the status of Vinopal. I’m hearing you, what is your opinion on the staff trying another Michigan DB transfer at the safety spot,Cullen Christian? When he was on the field as a cornerback he looked like he had the speed to be able to handle the safety positions to me. Of course closing speed is only one component required, the other more essential one is the ability to read the play early on enough to get to the ball with the proper anticipation. But I’d give this kid a look, if for no other reason than to provide more depth at the safety spot.

Comment by Dr. Tom 08.03.13 @ 10:22 am

Dr T – I had a chance to me the extended Blewitt clan at the Somerset Rest area when I was driving up for the spring game. They are really excited about his going to PITT and his Dad was telling me how his son blew everyone away at the various kicking camps he went to… hence the scholarship. I agree, he’ll be a good one.

Comment by Reed 08.03.13 @ 3:20 pm

WOW!! That Conner kid from Erie looks AWESOME!! He accelerates beautifully. He also breaks tackles nicely as a 230 pounder should. Perhaps. in time, Pitt’s running attack will be a SECRET WEAPON. Rev. George from Columbus.

Comment by Rev. George Mehaffey 08.04.13 @ 4:34 pm

Thanks Justin. Caw

Comment by Caw Miller 08.06.13 @ 6:19 am

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