October 20, 2012

Open Thread: Pitt-Buffalo

Filed under: Football,Open Thread — Chas @ 12:16 pm

Hey, a 3:30 start! That’s different. Oh, wait it’s on the road. At… Buffalo. The things you have to do in scheduling. It was a 2-for-1 deal that meant Pitt didn’t have to buy the Buffalo appearances. Considering they got $1,000,000 from Georgia it makes some sense. It also tell tells you the going rate these days to get a 1-A non-BCS program to do a one-offer — and why everyone is using 1-AA schools now.

Not even sure I’ll be able to see the game. We are visiting some of my family this weekend, so I’m not even sure if the game will be shown where we are.

Temple 10 Rutgers 0 late second Qt. Beware of the Owls.

Comment by alcofan 10.20.12 @ 1:31 pm

If Tino has difficulty dealing with the Buffalo rush today, look for Anderson or Voytik.

Comment by PittofDreams 10.20.12 @ 1:35 pm

not gonna happen … Sunseri has played well for 4 games and is a top 15 passer statistically, plus Voytik is being redshirted. Those hating on Sunseri will have to wait 6 more games (7 if they somehow make a bowl). It’s not even worth arguing now – the end is near and the kid has been destroyed enough. Sunseri’s tenure will just have to run it’s course naturally.

Comment by Tossing Thabeets 10.20.12 @ 1:56 pm

Temple-Rutgers starting to look like Pitt- Louisville game.

Comment by Pitt Dad 10.20.12 @ 2:32 pm

game is on wtae?

Comment by frankarms 10.20.12 @ 2:57 pm

Game is on ESPN3

Comment by PittFan28 10.20.12 @ 3:13 pm

For anyone who has the sports package on DirecTV, it looks like channels 639 and 640 have the game.

Comment by Kenny Powers 10.20.12 @ 3:22 pm

menu on tv shows channel 4

Comment by frankarms 10.20.12 @ 3:22 pm

Pat Bostick just said on the radio, this game should be a slugfest, a slugfest with Buffalo, how far have we fallen?

Comment by Moe Greene 10.20.12 @ 3:23 pm

account of the weather, its raining all day there

Comment by frankarms 10.20.12 @ 3:24 pm

Get a W and get out of Buffalo ASAP. We
are desperate and have the Owls on the

Comment by JR 10.20.12 @ 3:28 pm

I rather watch the Ohio State vs. Purdue game ….change it back ASAP!…

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:34 pm

game is on wtae channel 4

Comment by frankarms 10.20.12 @ 3:36 pm

I seriously can’t wait until Kevin Harper earns his degree.

Comment by Kenny Powers 10.20.12 @ 3:37 pm

ESPN3 just died on U-verse.

Comment by OhHowIHateOhioState 10.20.12 @ 3:39 pm

Wit what did he do…I missed the kickoff?

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:39 pm

Is there 1000 people at this game? Wow.

Comment by ECH 10.20.12 @ 3:40 pm

Kicked it out of bounds. Just a bad year for the guy

Comment by Kenny Powers 10.20.12 @ 3:40 pm

I’ll say 550

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:44 pm

Two titans of the grid iron battling it out today!

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:45 pm

Game blacked out on ESPN3 in NY. SNY hasn’t switched over to it from Temple-Rutgers. Any idea what’s going on?

Comment by Pitt Dad 10.20.12 @ 3:45 pm

Buffalo is bad.

Comment by Mailman 10.20.12 @ 3:46 pm

It is blacked out on espn3 in my area. Any suggestions

Comment by M24romano 10.20.12 @ 3:46 pm

Wait I thought Western Pennsylvania plays high school football games on Friday night….how are we playing Plum right now?….actual Plum draws more than this game.

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:48 pm

Watch another game you’re not missing much.

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:49 pm

If anyone in New England/NY gets MASN, it’s on that station

Comment by Kenny Powers 10.20.12 @ 3:50 pm

On SNY now

Comment by Pitt Dad 10.20.12 @ 3:51 pm

The kid actually made one…wow…but does it count. If no one saw it…haha

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:52 pm

If the game is blacked out and you have a smart phone, CBS SportCaster is a good app for play-by-play.

Comment by OhHowIHateOhioState 10.20.12 @ 3:53 pm

3-0 Pitt… on 45 field goal by Harper

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:54 pm

Am I the only one on this site today?

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:56 pm

There’s not very much to comment on thus far.

Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.20.12 @ 3:58 pm

Presidential Elections?

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 3:59 pm

Yay. Harper is 2-2.

Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.20.12 @ 4:05 pm

gotta question the red zone play calling…

Comment by goalie44 10.20.12 @ 4:06 pm

I will say one thing, I’m not sure a pre-injury, 100% Ray Graham would be able to keep Rushel Shell off the field. He is a beast. Did he have all 70 yards on that drive?

Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.20.12 @ 4:06 pm

he did and was exhausted at the end, but they kept running him. give him a one play rest

Comment by goalie44 10.20.12 @ 4:09 pm

Pitt Dad…
thanks…. blacked out on Espn3… never looked at sny.

Comment by Joe D 10.20.12 @ 4:14 pm

Need TD’s in the red zone!

Comment by Pitt2004 10.20.12 @ 4:15 pm

Joe D – on SNY now – pbp and analysis are dull

Comment by Pitt Dad 10.20.12 @ 4:17 pm

great job shell!!

Comment by goalie44 10.20.12 @ 4:21 pm

why does graham not play much anymore? Ive been frustrated with this team to the point where i’m not keeping up to date on this nonsense.

Comment by ClarkLotTgate 10.20.12 @ 4:22 pm

Shell bailed out Tino’s brain fart on the scramble.

Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.20.12 @ 4:22 pm

Graham and Shell typically alternate series. I think they play about equal snaps.

Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.20.12 @ 4:24 pm

Shell is averaging about 15 yards a touch so far this game, so you can’t really fault him seeing the field more.

Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.20.12 @ 4:25 pm

@Marco The empty seats are on Pitt’s side of the field .

Comment by MariettaMike 10.20.12 @ 4:25 pm


Comment by FRANKCAN 10.20.12 @ 4:26 pm

Is Donald the only defensive lineman we have? Nobody else seems to make plays, even against…buffalo

Comment by Kenny Powers 10.20.12 @ 4:31 pm

@MarriettaMike Does Pitt side of the field include both end zones??

Comment by ECH 10.20.12 @ 4:34 pm

@ECH Just one end zone. 😉

Comment by MariettaMike 10.20.12 @ 4:37 pm

what is the score

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.20.12 @ 4:44 pm

why don’t we throw downfield again??

Comment by goalie44 10.20.12 @ 4:45 pm

Bad team beating high school team 13-3

Comment by Marco 10.20.12 @ 4:46 pm

I thought we were supposed to have good safeties?

Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.20.12 @ 4:48 pm

wow, another coach that goes for it on 4th down..although they are 1-5..

Comment by goalie44 10.20.12 @ 4:49 pm

up by 7 at the half. pathetic…

Comment by goalie44 10.20.12 @ 4:54 pm

Wow is this game horrible! I thought I was watching a Penn ST game for a minute

Comment by toga toga toga 10.20.12 @ 4:55 pm

A rather uninspired half.

Comment by ECH 10.20.12 @ 4:55 pm

A horrible game or 2 horrible teams ?

Comment by WLAT and The Big Beat 10.20.12 @ 5:00 pm

i mean, what is it? why are they so uninspired?? is it the coach?,the players? wtf is it?? it is embarasing!

Comment by goalie44 10.20.12 @ 5:00 pm

Halftime and let me number the mistakes on a disgraceful effort by Pitt. Reminds me of a bad Baldwin – Belle Vernon game. No fans, band cannot even play Rocky correctly.

Pitt again comes out scratching their asses and immediately kicks the kickoff out of bounds.
Tino staring down recievers “statue like” as usual. Pitt goes to kickoff after the TD and refs make us hold the ball as it blows off the tee.
Holder pulls a “Lucy” and lets the ball go before the kicker makes his second stride…somehow the kicker kicks it 14 yards. Pass defense is getthing shredded by a Penn STate related QB. Pitt pursues a scrambling BBill QB Zorich from every angle but the correct one and time after time he picks up first downs.

We are really awful and play with no emotion at all. A reflection on the coaching staff for sure.

Comment by Dan 72 10.20.12 @ 5:02 pm

We don’t throw downfield because the friggen wind was 40 mph in our face.
There is nothing to stop the wind. It ain’t Tinos fault and it ain’t PC.
this place is a shithole.
Reason number 1000 to fire Cyanide Steve. Who in their right mind schedules a game in Buffalo in late October?
Secondary playing fairly well.
We will have to roll out pass or Charlie Brown and the Peanuts gang could put 8 in the box and stop the run.
Going into this wind, with nothing to stop it , is limecplaying on having first and 15.

Comment by SFPitt 10.20.12 @ 5:05 pm

A reflection of the coaching staff and lack of on the field leadership/emotion too.

Comment by ECH 10.20.12 @ 5:05 pm

Meant to write like playing 1st and 15 on every possession into the wind.
Muddy fields use to equalize teams, but this wind is worse.

Comment by SFPitt 10.20.12 @ 5:08 pm

Even if we end up winning this monstosity we come out as losers.

We are so flat and so slow that it almost looks as if we are in the tank with the bookies. This time I have decided to stop defending Chryst & Co.
It is OBVIOUS that this is a team that will have a disasterous season….a season so bad that it could set us back at least three or four more years until we attain a .500 won/lost %.

I believe that we are going to get crushed in the recruiting wars and as weak as the ACC is compared with other BCS Conferences we will be bottom feeders. Yes, I know this is only one game, yes we will probably win, however, if the lack of heart and desire being demonstrated today is any indication of our future the only thing that I can say is…Bring on the basketball season. A double OY VEY for Emel.

Comment by isnore 10.20.12 @ 5:13 pm


Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.20.12 @ 5:29 pm

Wow is this game boring. Watching paint dry is more exciting. I watched the Clemson-Va Tech game, and it is night and day compared to this. Eh.

Comment by pittbluegold 10.20.12 @ 5:38 pm


This is Pitt football. It’s a sad state of affairs man.

Comment by Kenny Powers 10.20.12 @ 5:55 pm

TS slides way too early. Doesn’t want to get hurt & risk a losing season.

Comment by OhHowIHateOhioState 10.20.12 @ 5:57 pm

Usually, a QB running for a first down is considered a good play. And usually, if a QB slides it’s because the HC has instructed him to do so.

But since it’s Sunseri, clearly he must be criticized.

Comment by Navy Panther 10.20.12 @ 6:00 pm

Pitt’s defense does not seem to be able to get off blocks at all today…OK all season

Comment by Dan 72 10.20.12 @ 6:09 pm

Even more than the Louisville game this one has shown me just how bad Pitt’s defense is. Luckily Buffalo’s so bad they couldn’t finish drives today.

Comment by deepelemblues 10.20.12 @ 6:22 pm

Take the win and move on. No need to harp on doom and gloom. Ill take this boring ugly game over the YSU game anyday. Its our last year of Tino ball and some of these other kids who had their careers marred by the revolving coaching carosel. They will be fine in the ACC.

Comment by mike 10.20.12 @ 6:33 pm

You’d think Pitt would show some freakin pride and try and stop these guys here, looks like they’re more interested in getting the game over as fast as possible. One of the worst defensive series I’ve seen all year

Comment by Kenny Powers 10.20.12 @ 6:35 pm

just such a sad game to watch

Comment by Timmeh 10.20.12 @ 6:39 pm

Good to see Dan Mason make the final tackle. Possibly my favorite Pitt player of all time.

Comment by Outlaw 10.20.12 @ 6:41 pm

In the books, it goes down as a W…nothing more to add.

Hail to PITT!

Comment by Oregon_Panther 10.20.12 @ 6:49 pm

Really nice to see Dan Mason get 11 tackles, reportedly matching his career high.

Comment by PittFan28 10.20.12 @ 6:52 pm

Nothing much to say about this game other than…WE WON!

Hail To Pitt!

Comment by Leaseman 10.20.12 @ 7:04 pm

This may have already been addressed, but did we target a tight end at all in the game? I thought this offense was going to incorporate the tight ends a lot more. I realize that Hubie Graham and Drew Carswell were both injured but we haven’t seen much of the tight ends all year.

Comment by Outlaw 10.20.12 @ 7:18 pm

Ok guys.
This game was played in the worst conditions I have ever endured. Not even close. I stood next to the cameraman fir most of the game. “this fucking sucks”..”what is this shit”..”I’m getting too old for this”. All because the wind, rain, sleet was coming at us horizontally.
Ive stopped to eat and have read much doom and gloom.
I totally disagree. I assure you, unless you sat at the game and thru this, you have no idea how easy it would have been to lose.
Any and every win is a good win.
Good job by Kevin Harper.
Mason made the most of his diminished ability.
That is all you can ask.

Comment by SFPitt 10.20.12 @ 7:18 pm

Outlaw – on the radio pregame show, they said that there are 2 main reason Holtz is not getting thrown to – 1, they need him to block since the tackles are getting beat up, as Rotheram showed today on a couple key occasions, and 2 – he’s still a true freshman, and between blocking and route running he’s still learning.

A boring game to watch, but consider that under those conditions we played not to lose and to not turn it over, which were both successful.

Comment by KeyboardKev 10.20.12 @ 7:21 pm

Wow was that hard to watch!!…Let’s talk predictions for next week…I say Temple 17 Pitt 13……..

Comment by pitt-for-life 10.20.12 @ 7:26 pm

3 cheers for SFPitt, for going to the game and having to endure the long plane trip, the 40mph wind, the horizontal rain, the sleet, Sir Tino and our beloved horrible PITT Panthers. Hip, hip…. Hooray !

You sir are a trooper !

Comment by Emel 10.20.12 @ 7:34 pm

Oh I forgot, SFPitt had to endure the Brown Shirts of the TSA too ! Hopefully you didn’t get hand raped, lol

Comment by Emel 10.20.12 @ 7:40 pm

Bravo SFPitt

Comment by steve1 10.20.12 @ 7:44 pm

Thank you SF Pitt for enduring those conditions.
That 40Mph wind really hurt Tino today. By my count he had 9 passes thrown behind the receiver (3 were actually caught)2 passes across his body, not even close and of course one long pass to a wide open reciever in the end zone incomplete,short and late. That wind had to be a bitch because Tino never throwns like this…..oh wait..he does it every week!

A win is a win for this team. HTP 40 mph wind and all.

Comment by Dan 72 10.20.12 @ 7:44 pm

SFPitt – go to Canada – drink, gamble and Lindy’s Lane!! Thanks for being a Pitt fan!

Comment by markp 10.20.12 @ 7:45 pm

As for the game ? (oy vey, oy vey)

Worst team in the BigLeast vs the worst team in the MAC, and ppl wonder why the crowd was sparse. haha :-)

Throw in the lovely weather conditions and not even the magnificent Sir Tino (he of the Top 10 passing efficiency rating) could draw them in, for this classic.

Headline should read:
” PITT escapes with victory, meh ”


P.S. Former PITT recruit Gary Nova threw 4 TD passes as undefeated, Top 20 Rutgers (yes Rutgers) blew past Temple in the 2nd half. All under their first year head coach Kyle Flood. Oy Vey
Yes the world is indeed topsy turvy !

Comment by Emel 10.20.12 @ 7:53 pm

Hey, they won!

On a more serious note, the game against Temple will be a true test to determine if Pitt is indeed mediocre.

Comment by PittofDreams 10.20.12 @ 8:07 pm

On one of our fav topics. Pitt uniforms, lol
Somebody in control of those things must be reading some our posts on here. lol

As several of us (including your’s truly) suggested we ditch the white/blue pants disaster we showed in Syracuse. (if u remember we called them hand-me-down uni’s, akronlike if u will)

Well today they went with a suggestion of our’s, the white tops with the gold bottoms, ala UCLA, GT or ND. And while it didn’t help much in the performance, though we did get the W and a W on the Road is a good W cause they could have very easily lost this game. PITT looked much better in it’s appearance on the field.

check it out:
link to

Sir Tino even looks like a real QB in this pic !
Appearances can be everything. :-)

Cudos to whoever made the decision to go, with the white jerseys and the gold bottoms.

Comment by Emel 10.20.12 @ 8:53 pm

pathetic a win but pathetic temple will be a true test how pathetic is that statement can we sink lower.

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.20.12 @ 8:57 pm

This feels like 1995 all over again. If we lose to Temple I will have to check the calendar.

Comment by Yeti 10.20.12 @ 9:01 pm

Meanwhile in Morganhole,

The billies are getting clobbered 52-7 by the Professor’s Kansas State still in the 3rd quarter ! (this after last week’s ass whoopin by Texas Tech)
They are finding out now what it’s like playing real teams every week. Goodbye Top 25 hoopies !

K State (ranked #4) NEVER has a Top 30 recruiting class, so it can be done. Bill Snyder (ie, The Professor) relies heavily in bringing in ready made JUCO players,( hint hint )!

Comment by Emel 10.20.12 @ 9:30 pm

Pitt got trounced in the stats. Wow! I’m sure the Panthers would have lost to around 115 other teams today in D1 football.

Comment by move_on 10.20.12 @ 9:47 pm

Yeti I was thinking 1994, is this back to the future III?

Comment by WLAT and The Big Beat 10.20.12 @ 10:08 pm

Wow. I know Pitt had a tough time against a supposedly inferior opponent, but they won. At some point you have to either say, ok this team has had to go through a ridiculous stretch with coaches and an AD who should have been fired year

Comment by kris 10.20.12 @ 10:13 pm

Watching Duke/UNC after MD/NCST – next to Duke and MD – we will have the ugliest unis in the ACC and not win many games (the first year).

Comment by markp 10.20.12 @ 10:34 pm

Final score: Toledo 29 Cincy 23

Yes, we are that bad!!

Comment by isnore 10.20.12 @ 10:48 pm

A win is a win…
I will take it… but it WAS a gimme..

As for Toledo… they are a good team!!

Comment by Joe D 10.20.12 @ 10:54 pm

I guess our Panthers need style points in future wins to satisfy some cynics on thus blog. We won! Next week we’ll beat Temple. HTP!

Comment by MariettaMike 10.20.12 @ 11:14 pm

Dan Mason ties career high with 11 tackles. In an otherwise boring game this is a bright highlight for Pitt and this incredible player.

Comment by Jeff in CPa 10.20.12 @ 11:23 pm

Yes that deserves recognition. PITT’s defense led by the aforementioned DAN MASON (what a wonderful story) kept Buffalo OUT of the Endzone today. While they did bend, they didn’t break and were responsible for today’s win. Including Jason Hendricks interception which led to one of our two TD’s.

And when it counted in the 4rth Quarter the DEFENSE came up big with 2 HUGE stops of 2 deep into PITT territory, Buffalo drives.

GREAT JOB, Dan Mason, Jason Hendricks and the rest of the PITT Defense.

Veritas et Virtus !

Comment by Emel 10.20.12 @ 11:34 pm

PENN STATE has a new first year coach they have had trouble for 2 years .
they lost there best WR and RB and 8 outher players off there team to transfer.
they are 5 and 2.
if there players are that mutch better then ares
we must have a team of garabge or there coach is
better then chryst,
which is it.
i dont see them saying wait till next year
how could we have recruited this bad most are daves players.
our is it the coaching you tell me how can we be this bad.
and they with all they lost that good.

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.20.12 @ 11:46 pm


Maybe this is their version of Pitt 1997.

Comment by Stoosh 10.20.12 @ 11:55 pm

I don’t always get some of the cynicism that permeates the forum here.

I get the rational criticism of certain things, and there’s plenty of room for that with this team, coaching staff and program. And I understand some of the frustrations, especially those of the long-time fans.

But for this season and this team, what did we all really expect? I know what a lot of us *hoped* for, but what did we really EXPECT?

Has any other BCS-level program ever gone through what this program has in the last two seasons? The level of turmoil that the bulk of this roster has endured is pretty much unprecedented.

I guess that’s why I don’t get it. I don’t get the excessive amounts of cynicism. I don’t get the roster envy and program envy I see from some here.

Rutgers this. Penn State that. Whatever. I don’t get it.

Does it really matter to Pitt what Penn State is doing right now? Why do we keep measuring ourselves by Penn State? The kids on that Penn State roster and some of the recruits don’t give a flying fornication about the scandal there; they’ve already said as much. Wait until the sanctions kick in and the bottom really falls out there, and we’ll see if some of them are still singing the same tune.

(And yes, I know we’re competing with Penn State for recruits this year. Please. At this point, would any of their commits step in immediately and help here next year where we need it? Nope. Not unless you want to make Breneman a tackle. By the time most of those kids are contributing, their sanctions will have long kicked in and who knows what that on-field product will look like.)

Remember two weeks ago when everyone was falling all over WVU and Holgorsen? Look at how much THAT situation has changed in just two weeks. Their fans were absolutely melting down tonight. Would any of us really want to trade places with that program right now and have to watch that defense? I’m not sure I would. I can tell you that none of them seem certain that they’ll ever be able to field a defense that can stop some of those teams.

I guess this is my point…

What’s gone on here the last two years is unprecedented. Largely self-inflicted (and that’s sad), but unprecedented.

At some point, though, the Pitt program had to draw a line and mark that as the “starting over” point (the moment Graham bolted). At that point, you shift all focus to everything going forward. You don’t write off the short-term, but you also recognize that there will be some collateral damage because it’s pretty much the nature of the beast. You begin rebuilding it, with emphasis on the “BUILD” part of that.

What ultimately starts to happen in 2013 and 2014 will be several times more important for Pitt than what happens this year. This year was and always has been about Chyrst getting his system in place, seeing what he has to work with and setting those foundations.

This is why Tino still making some of the same mistakes doesn’t bother me this year; he won’t be a factor in two more months.

This is why the progress the offensive line makes from this year to next is exponentially more important than what they’ve done from last year to this year.

Don’t get me wrong – I want to see them win. We all do. But the ultimate win-loss record they finish with this year pales in relative importance to Chryst getting those foundations built this year for the next two years.

Comment by Stoosh 10.21.12 @ 12:56 am

Appreciate the Battlefield promotion guys. I’ll pick up my Badge of Courage at the Temple game.
Gotta agree with Stoosh. I have written and said many times that no team in the history of college football has had to endure the ridiculous circus of the last 2.5 years. Totally unprofessional and that falls on Cyanide Steve.
We don’t have the players Penn State does, we don’t have their money or candidly, their pedigree. We have 30 years of mostly bad football and a fan base that knows the game well and won’t support the idiocy of these times.
The only way to turn the team/program toward success is one play at a time, one game at a time, etc.
Yesterday, because there were so few people at the game (how much did this game cost us Stevie?), I was able to get close to the field and bench.
What I loved was the attitude; Our body language; our presence. On a day when no one wanted to be there (refs and cameramen included), Pitt’s players did.
That may not mean anything to analysts, but you start the future with NOW and recruit players with similar DNA.
I fired Cyanide Steve, but I am sticking with the coaches and players. They deserve it for what they have been thru. The future starts here with this team.

Comment by SFPitt 10.21.12 @ 7:04 am

It is Sunday morning… I suggest you read the WVU story by COOK….
I like Holgerson..
He has fire in the belly.. now that is a BCS D1 coach!!
whereas Chryst… ho hum… oh, we want to get better… accepting mediocrity.

Comment by Joe D 10.21.12 @ 7:58 am

Well said stoosh! Some on this forum forget that these kids are mostly 18 to 20 years old. Lets back our Panthers, win or lose. There is hope on this forum for some skeptics but there is no hope on this forum for cynics. This Pitt team is doing the best they can. Yesterday under poor playing conditions they kept Buffalo out of the end zone. What more needs to be said.
And I might add, they beat the Vegas point spread.

Hail to Pitt!

Comment by MariettaMike 10.21.12 @ 8:02 am

Gotta have the guys pumped up for Temple.

Beat Temple and we’re back to 4-4.

I will also be cheering (as hard as it is to do, especially with some in my family being fans), for Notre Dame to beat Oklahoma.

It will then be a prime time, for Pitt to pick off a #4 or #5, undefeated Notre Dame team on national t.v..

Oh, my, that would be so sweet!!! Another 13-9???


Comment by Dan 10.21.12 @ 8:12 am

The program has went through a transitional stage with the headcoaching merry go round. The starting 5 on the oline have problems and the quality of depth behind them currently on the roster is questionable but I see the same situation next year. The dline is in the same situation, with Price back next year the LBs are better but again lack of quality depth and no real impact type recruits.

The 2013 recruiting class is vital and I just don’t see a strong foundation there, they better stay on Johnson and recruit him hard.

Comment by WLAT and The Big Beat 10.21.12 @ 8:31 am

Excellent post Stoosh!!

Joe D…if giving up over 200 points in just 4 weeks is your kind of what a “BCS D1 Coach” looks like, I suggest you stick to your real area of expertise: track & field.

Comment by ECH 10.21.12 @ 8:40 am

I suggest you read the article…
you obviously didn’t.
The point was the fire in the belly… Holgerson is sooooo competitive he was angry at the loss and ready to kick a$$…
Chyrst on the other hand… ho hum… think YSU!!

Comment by Joe D 10.21.12 @ 8:54 am

Your post is just full of excuses…
I bet you never were a manager with P&L responsibility…
It’s all about benchmarking and comparing to others.. you may not like it… but it is what it is.
What is your excuse going to be next year??? and the year after that???

Comment by Joe D 10.21.12 @ 8:58 am

Temple’s quarterback is terrible.

If Tino stays upright, Pitt wins and the STREAK IS ON!

Comment by PittofDreams 10.21.12 @ 9:01 am

By the way, Pitt D on much better ground with Mason in the middle.

Saw him having some difficulty changing direction but as long as he’s moving in one direction he looks good.

D-Lineman still look like chickens without heads out there. Make that SLOW chickens.

Comment by PittofDreams 10.21.12 @ 9:06 am

Joe D, I did read the article you mindnumbingly idiotic fool. And, unlike you, I took his comments for what they were: coach-speak for “whats gonna happen now” after getting his ass handed to him two weeks in a row.

Comment by ECH 10.21.12 @ 9:07 am

Stoosh–what I did expect and think we fans legitimately had a right to expect were at least two more wins (YSU and Cuse) irrespective of the situation caused by the totally mis-managed–thank you Mr Pederson–way (in both manner and timing) in which Wannstadt was let go and the almost predictable aftermath. This team should be 5-2 and fans have a legitimate gripe that it isn’t, IMO.

What is also troubling is that, at least on paper, the current recruiting class doesn’t look like the kind of strong class needed to truly jump start a rebuilding effort. Of course, we fans do hope we are wrong and it’s members ultimately will prove far better on the field than they project on paper at this time.

Comment by pitt1972 10.21.12 @ 9:10 am

Stoosh – that was one of the most thoughtful posts I’ve read this year. Bravo!!!

SFPitt – enjoyed and appreciated your posts here and on Dokish’s blog.

JoeD – that’s not fire in Holgerson’s belly. It’s leftover booze from the lobby bar of the hotel he lives in.

I’ll take the “shucks and gee whiz” family man everyday. It’s not just about winning. How we win is just as important.

Comment by Joe Lawrence 10.21.12 @ 9:15 am

Joe Lawrence…
But… we are not winning…. we have a losing record!!
I don’t want to hear… oh, let him get the players, etc etc… hogwash…
Look at 1st year HC…. O’Brien at PSU… the Rutgers HC…

Comment by Joe D 10.21.12 @ 9:24 am

Excellent post, Stoosh! Many will hate it that you brought a dose a realism into their sea of despair.

Most people thought this was a 7-5 or 8-4 talented team at the start of the season. So young and thin on defense, bad at quarterback, bad on o-line and thin everywhere. Major questions at running back (health & unpredictable freshman) and wide receivers who took last season off.

Most on here kept commenting about how injuries would make or break the season. Since then we’ve lost our starting left tackle (suspension), and been hit fairly hard by injuries on defense. Price, Thomas, M. Williams, Lippert, Gordon, K Williams, Pardner. Our depth has been seriously challenged on defense and I second emel’s cheers for Dan Mason and defense that won yesterday’s game for us.

So many good things to like on this team going into next year, why obsess over the negatives and concerns? As a Pitt fan, I know that’s what we do and we have 30 years that have taught us that.

If Chryst can get the type of numbers out of the passing game that he has this year, I can’t wait to see what he gets from Savage, Voytik & Chapman. I can’t wait to see how much our defense improves next year with hopefully 8 or 9 starters back and having a lot more experience.

I’d rather focus on these positive things in a public forum than the negatives, day after day, after day.

Now, can we beat Temple and finish strong to the season? Can we get a couple more o-line or d-line recruits? Can we find some way to coach up or put our o-line or d-line in better position to succeed?

Comment by Bowling Green Panther 10.21.12 @ 9:25 am

Just to let you know…
PSU is 5-2… they went through more the past year than Pitt in the past 2.. they lost top players, etc.
Rutgers is 7-0… new HC…

btw BGP and Stoosh… I forecasted 6-6… anyone higher than that was drinking the koolaid… now I’m not sure if they will win more than 4 games…

Comment by Joe D 10.21.12 @ 9:30 am

Here are the Holgy’s quotes that I like that make him a winner.

“We’ve got to get this program to where it needs to be,” Holgorsen said, agreeing fully.

“I thought we were ready to play,” Holgorsen said. “Nobody likes what’s going on. We’ll get back to work and try to put a better product out there the next time.”

“No excuses. It starts with me,” West Virginia coach Dana Holgorsen said.

Did you ever hear Chryst say those things… Chryst doesn’t even have any goals… no accountability, etc. That was a response to a question…

Comment by Joe D 10.21.12 @ 9:35 am

@Joe D — So Pitt goes 6 & 6, what’s wrong with that? I don’t care about Penn State, WVU or Rutgers, only Pitt.

Chryst is doing a fine job with what he has to work with. Let’s give Chryst a chance before parking a moving van outside his house.

Comment by MariettaMike 10.21.12 @ 9:51 am

JosephD – c’mon man! We all know the PSU and Rutgers rosters were more loaded than Pitt’s…

I’m a senior level mgr with P&L responsibility and I know something about benchmarking. It’s OK to do that with Pitt, PSU and Rutgers, but one has to actually analyze why the differences occur. All three have entirely different situations. It’s way too simplistic – and a bit sloppy – to compare them based on this season.

Now, if you want to compare them based on the past 5-10 years performance, the comparison is more legit. But PC isn’t the underlying cause of Pitt’s failures relative to those guys.

IMO – based on reading your posts over the past couple years – You prefer a guy who is more demonstrative to the media. And in that regard, be careful that you aren’t being manipulated by a salesman.

Comment by Joe Lawrence 10.21.12 @ 9:51 am

Chryst can obviously coach offense and I’m not concerned with that side of the ball. Chryst also can recruit for his system so he won’t need an offense full of 4 and 5 star players. My concern is the defense. You can’t get by without those 4 and 5 star players and he’s going to have to get recruiters on that side of the ball. A D full of 3 star players will get torched and the offense will always have to try and outscore the opponent possession by possession ala WVU. Not the way to play the game.

Comment by Tossing Thabeets 10.21.12 @ 9:52 am

Joe D– I respect where you’re coming from; none of us enjoy seeing the program in the state it’s been the past few years. However, we are not a direct comparison to other programs with a first-year head coach. Pitt football has imploded in a way unique to us over the past two years, thanks to having four head coaches during this period.

It would have been great for the past two years to have left no lasting ill effects on the program, but that was always an unrealistic hope. I’m not blindly optimistic about Coach Cryst, but I don’t think it is unrealistic to expect him to need multiple years to repair the damage to the program. (I also think it is a miracle that there are decent recruits even considering Pitt after these past two years.)

Comment by Navy Panther 10.21.12 @ 9:55 am

We all have hope that Pitt will improve to at least get to 6 wins, get the local recruits, build for next year. Depressing though to see other teams playing with excitement and speed.

PSU has us against the world and it is working for them. WVU hopes of national championship went to zero when they entered B12.

Comment by Frank MD 10.21.12 @ 9:58 am

Those hyping up Holgersen for what he says must not watch the NFL. Rex Ryan is all talk and his teams are constantly mediocre. There have been many great soft-spoken family-first type coaches…heck we might have one in Jamie Dixon. You don’t hear to much coach speak from him. I get the feeling Coach Heywood or whatever his name was would have given you plenty of rah-rah talk. But that doesn’t win games.

I am willing to give Chryst his due time before making judgments. I am not thrilled with his recruiting at this point but we will see. Football is all about your O and D lines and with Pitt’s at this point it is hard to be successful. Any anyone calling for for Wanny to come back these are his recruits on the O line. And for those asking for Walt he was fired partly b/c he never recruited good lines.

Comment by bdubb 10.21.12 @ 9:58 am

Here’s what we should all hope for…. A bid to the Pinstripe Bowl versus the Mounties. The Bronx Brawl. Win or lose, that would be a nice end to a season of transition.

Comment by Joe Lawrence 10.21.12 @ 10:01 am

@ Joe D: “No excuses. It starts with me.” – Wasn’t that the case BEFORE his team was lit up for over a C-Note in two weeks?

Your predictable posts reveal your blind spot Joe D…an affinity for style over substance. I highly doubt you have ANY P&L responsibility, in fact, your arrogant and superficial perspective indicates you are a middle manager more focused on creating the “appearance” of success versus actually taking the real steps to achieve it.

Besides, if you you really have P&L responsibilities like you claim, I seriously question how seriously you take those responsibilities since you find the time to insistently vomit your arrogance on any and every blog site dedicated to Pitt athletics.

Comment by ECH 10.21.12 @ 10:03 am

I lived in upstate NY for 15 years, and the kind of weather that Pitt played in yesterday was one of the main reasons that I now live in Virginia. STPitt, my hat goes off to you Sir, If you stayed at that game until the end, you deserve combat pay. Has the feeling returned to your fingers yet?

You guys who are so hypercritical of Pitt’s performance HAVE NO IDEA of how much of an equalizer that kind of weather can be in a game. You nailed it SFPitt, I like the attitude of this team also. There is not an enormous amount of talent on this team but I haven’t seen them mail it in yet this season in any of their games. How anybody keeps their spirits up in that game yesterday is beyond me. By halftime anybody that wasn’t getting paid to be there in the second half was looking for a dry seat and a hot toddy next to the fireplace. Yeah, Pitt has been soundly beaten this year, but they have never hung their heads, even when it was YSU handing out the ass whoopin.

Yesterday wasn’t a quality win but it was a WIN. Any of you critics out there who follow Pitt should KNOW how fragile this team’s situation is now. This game could have been lost due to these horrible conditions and the fact that Pitt is so adept at playing down to their opposition. If you actually know this team, you should be simply happy that they won the game and can move on to the next one witn another victory under their belts.

Enjoy the upside, no Pitt turnovers, Tino actually ran for first downs, Harper made all of his kicks for PATs and FGs in absolutely terrible weather, WHAT??? This defense kept them out of the endzone and Dan Mason started at middle LB and had eleven tackles. This glass is more than half full.

Gentlemen come on, this ain’t no top 50 team we’re analysing here. So just shut up, take the win and move on for Chryst’s sake.

Comment by Dr. Tom 10.21.12 @ 10:07 am

Joe D, I’m pretty sure Tony Dungy destroys any theory you have about how to coach.

Comment by marcus of schaumburg 10.21.12 @ 10:43 am

I thought Pitt did a good job yesterday considering the conditions. There were no major gaffes from the coaches. I always support the players, but the coaches are making good money and must be responsible for their efforts (coaching and recruiting). Just like any other business, the administration and coaches are ultimately for the success or failure of the program. Far too many failures over the last 30 years.

Comment by Pittstadiumshuffle 10.21.12 @ 10:55 am

ultimately responsible

Comment by Pittstadiumshuffle 10.21.12 @ 10:56 am

Of course better to win, but it was a tough game to watch and I can’t really say I saw any progress. Same struggles to run the ball, same Tino near-grounding panic decision, same defense unable to get off the field, and most frustratingly same untimely penalties. Understand the conditions were poor, but I also thought this was a poor game for offensive play-calling. It almost felt like a scrimmage where Pitt didn’t want to show anything new. All of this vs. one of the worst teams in D-I. It’s not cynicism, but realism – sorry I can’t feel good about a 20-6 win over Buffalo.

Chryst has much to learn, but I have seen some things to like and of course want him to succeed. Pitt’s results this year have less to do with a first year coach than it does with talent. The bottom line is that this is just not a good team. They cant finish and are most likely going to be sub-.500 in the BE for the the first time since ’07. I do think we’re looking at another year or two of the same in the ACC. I hope I’m wrong, but there is not enough waiting in the wings to think otherwise.

Comment by Iron Duke 10.21.12 @ 11:00 am

Some positives of a few recent posts that make a good point – this team has done a great job of protecting the football, including yesterday. Also, the effort is there. I think Chryst has control over the team and I have yet to see quit. That gives me hope for future years. But gotta get some linemen, both sides.

Comment by Iron Duke 10.21.12 @ 11:09 am


– The team’s going to be inconsistent all year so I’ll take the wins, no matter how “pretty” they are.

– JoeD, some other new HC records you might want to keep in mind:

JL Smith (Ark) – 3-4

M Leach (Wash St) – 2-5 (wasn’t this Dorish’s pick for Pitt?)

C Weis (Kan) – 1-6

T Bechman (Ill) – 2-5

Rich Rod (Arz) – 4-3

And lot’s of people’s favorite instead of Chryst. Cristobol (FIU) 1-7

So yes, there are coaches that have had some success but let’s keep in mind that many will struggle until they get their people in place.

Great post Stoosh

Comment by burgh1972 10.21.12 @ 11:37 am

Well said Stoosh. Everyone downplays the coaching change. Idk what some ppl expected

Comment by Timmeh 10.21.12 @ 11:40 am

Agree @ Stoosh although I don’t agree with allowing Tino to run the offense. Listen, Tino is having a good year between the 20’s. Would prefer that other players get valuable experience in the Paul Chryst system. I do think he is taking a risk by not getting another qb with eligibility remaining (Anderson, Voytik)into these game, regardless of redshirt burning. The risk lies in the belief that Savage is the guy for next year. If Savage is not up to the task or injured, the next man up will have no college experience and that is not where you want to be in year two. I personally want my next qb to have valuable snaps. Just my personal preference, but defer to the head ball coach as he sees it every day.

This game again shows what happens when there are eight in the box against the panthers. Limits the running game success and dares the qb to hurt you. Our qb can’t hurt you because he can’t close the deal.

Psychologically, I also let the Arthur Doakes and other bacup linemen get playing time even if they are not the best choices right now. Going into the off season, giving them a taste of starting to see how they respond with winter conditioning can be enlightening. It also allows the staff to see if a player performs better under the lights on Saturdays. If they can’t cut the mustard (pun intended), than they need to have the thanks but you got to go speach with their coach during the winter. Free up schollies for folks that want to work to be their best. Any idea how Tyrique Jarrett is performing at the Academy? Big key this year will be to get signees into school early so they can participate in spring drills.

Oh and finally. The weather. It was terrible. So what. A golfer, a qb, a kicker, a baseball pitcher. Wind plays a factor but you need to know how the wind effects your game. The real good news for Pitt football is that 1/2 of their games going forward will be played in weather environments that are much more stable as they head south!! Can’t wait.

Comment by dhuffdaddy 10.21.12 @ 11:53 am

3-4 going into temple game with a real chance at 4-4.
3 more wins than I expected after beginning the season 0-2

Comment by Pitt fan in Atlanta 10.21.12 @ 12:15 pm

I had no great expectations for this season (or next for that matter). What I don’t accept, and will never accept for any reason/excuse (turmoil, new coach every year, injuries, recruiting, etc.) is the YSU loss. For my 30+ year history with this team that loss was an all-time low that I never want to experience again!….PSU roster more loaded than Pitt, even with the loss of players – There is no doubt about it. RUs roster “loaded” compared to Pitts – I doubt it. I believe in coach Chryst and far prefer him to Dana I’llhaveanotherone at WVU , but none of us should accept losing to D2 schools. It did not happen in our history and it should never happen again.

Comment by HbgFrank 10.21.12 @ 12:17 pm

Reality Check… Chryst inaugural season so far.

– Plus… Turned Sunseri into a SOLID error-free (1 interception) QB.
– Minus… Over-estimated his ability to turn Sunseri into a WINNER capable of making plays to snatch victory from the jaws of defeat (see Cincy end of half, Syracuse end of game)

– Plus… Proven himself to have the guts to GO FOR THE WIN and not play it safe unlike Wanny and others like Graham (see Wanny upset loss to Connecticut, Graham repeated third down punts inside enemy terriroty).
– Minus… Sometimes gone for it maybe with the wrong play call (See Louisville).

-Plus… Unlike Wanny does not play favorites and has been willing to play freshman and other young players in place of upperclassmen (See Shell, Pitts, Render).
-Minus…Has been willing to live or die with Sunseri without even getting another QB some snaps in package situations, for example a pass-run option or two (See YSU).

-Plus… Has shown a great deal of character as a Head Coach while also living up to his billing as a great offensive mind (See Sunseri and Passing Game).
-Minus… Has appeared to be a little too complacent at times in reacting to losses and unlike Graham a year ago seems unwilling to take a hands-on approach on Defense choosing instead to leave matters in the hands of his Assistants who have been inconsitent and sometimes downright awful in making adjustments that can mean the difference between winning and losing (See Louisville).

What have I missed?

Comment by PittofDreams 10.21.12 @ 12:24 pm

Unless we get some competent offensive tackles, I don’t see this team improving next year

Comment by Gas 10.21.12 @ 1:00 pm

Yesterdays game and telecast shows how far the program has fallen, thought I was watching IUP and Clarion playing. I think the AD and staff need to get their act together. I know this game goes back to a prior admin, but there wa splenty of time to renegotiate.

Comment by Jimbo 10.21.12 @ 1:04 pm

Uh-Oh, Corey Clement….

Comment by Timmeh 10.21.12 @ 1:54 pm

What is also troubling is that, at least on paper, the current recruiting class doesn’t look like the kind of strong class needed to truly jump start a rebuilding effort. Of course, we fans do hope we are wrong and it’s members ultimately will prove far better on the field than they project on paper at this time.


That’s certainly a very fair response.

The YSU loss was inexcusable. There’s no way around that. That was like re-living the Ohio loss in 2005 or the Bowling Green loss in 2008 – both of which killed early-season excitement for each respective season – only worse because it came at the hands of a Division I-AA team (FCS…whatever).

The ‘Cuse loss was inexcusable, too. It was a game they should’ve won and had chances to win. I wasn’t thrilled with some of the play-calling in that game, and even less thrilled with some of what that game revealed about the abilities of some of the players, particularly the offensive line. How much of the performances we’ve seen from the linemen is attributable to coaching, I’m not exactly sure. I’m hoping for the best…hoping that some of the younger guys are just dealing with adapting to their third blocking scheme in three years.

The recruiting for this season does concern me a little bit, too, especially in regards to the lack of linemen. I know the general consensus is that Foster, Johnson and Boyd would save all, and I do believe that Pitt will at least get Foster and Johnson. But I’d still like to see more. Hopefully that’s coming.

Certainly very fair criticisms and concerns.

Comment by Stoosh 10.21.12 @ 1:59 pm

Dokis reporting Corey Clement deccommits.

Big disappointment. But who can blame him?

Said before the season started that Chryst’s low-key manner and approach would not be a problem once recruits and their parents get to see the product he and his staff put on the field.


Obviously a little too much optimism.

Let’s just hope Chapman remains solid. Losing him would really hurt the future of the program… probably more than any other single recruit in my opinion.

Only thing certain to sure up things at this point would be a WIN STREAK. That means Temple followed by a HUGE UPSET in South Bend.

Not likely. But who knows?

Comment by PittofDreams 10.21.12 @ 2:37 pm

Stevens Howling rushes 20 times for 102 yds and a touchdown. The TD streak continues.

Comment by alcofan 10.21.12 @ 4:41 pm

Urban Meyer big threat to Pitt recruiting. Other B10 coaches now know Urban goes after recruits until they actually sign letter. Some coaches are unhappy.

Comment by Frank MD 10.21.12 @ 4:48 pm

Corey Clement…

Can I say I told you so regarding Chryst recruiting acumen!

Comment by Joe D 10.21.12 @ 5:30 pm

Joe D. Corey Clement was a soft commit, so he is going to a more steady, successful program who has a head coach who has been recruiting (lying) for a long time…no surprise to anyone…BFD, just because PC hasn’t recruited to your standards (4-5 stars, track stars, over 6’2″, etc), doesn’t mean he won’t be successful. Your negative comments show how little you know about team building, coaching, and football. Do your re-visit routine in 3 years, then you can say I told you so, or most likely – boy did I under estimate him…it takes time to learn to be a head coach, line backer, guard, recruiter, adult, etc…

Comment by markp 10.21.12 @ 5:55 pm

in 3years, when they fire Chryst… yes, I will say I told you so…
how that “coach em up” going so far!!

Comment by Joe D 10.21.12 @ 6:01 pm

If Clement didn’t want to compete for playing time with Shell then good riddance…

Comment by Pittastic 10.21.12 @ 6:08 pm

Well there seems to be a growing groundswell from several posters that we (and that includes PC) is building for the future or laying the groundwork.
And that most of us didn’t expect much this year.
(however I do remember the pre-season prediction post on how PITT would fair this year and Reed and I were on the low end at 7-5) And why not, we have lots of experience at QB, WR, RB, TE and several O-linemen (regardless of their talent level, that’s what Joe Huebner was brought in for, to teach em & coach em up). Plus PC is supposed to be a Offensive schematic genius, so surely we can figure out someway to block YSU, Cuse & Buffalo. Not exactly Murderers Row (to use a old baseball cliche). On the positive side, hey at least we didn’t lose all 3 games to Murderers Row.

Ok back to this notion, that seems to be growing here, that we need to give PC a pass this year.
Ok, let’s say I buy that, we give PC a pass this year and we need to think forward. EVERYTHING IS LOOKING FORWARD. Westward Ho !!

If we are indeed looking forward and planning for the future and at 0-3 in the BigLeast, that would be the prudent thing to do. Plan for the future.

Well the future does not include our 5th yr senior QB (thank God). So for those of you giving PC a pass, because he is building for the future, the future is Trey Anderson & Chad Voytik. And hopefully Tom Savage. Now since we can’t predict how a 3 year layoff will effect Tom Savage and we can’t predict whether or not he might get hurt, as he has a history of injuries. Wouldn’t it indeed be a prudent thing to do, to have either Anderson or Voytik ready for next season, by playing them THIS SEASON.

If you are indeed a proponent of giving PC a pass this year, because, again, you are looking forward. Forward to the Future. Then you also logically would want to have a QB ready, with substantial playing experience for next season.

I’m all in… on building for the future, are you?

Comment by Emel 10.21.12 @ 6:09 pm

I’m a BIG Chryst supporter or at least have been. But, it’s time for PC to ramp it up if he has it to do so.

Forget “growing” from games for awhile. It’s time for PC et al to buckle up the chin straps and win a couple of games with the cards they’ve been dealt.

Season on the line. Next recruiting class on the line.


Comment by PittofDreams 10.21.12 @ 6:14 pm

Pitt picked up a big TE from Ohio yesterday (waiting for Joe D. to complain) and they are playing better and better each game (IMHO). Coaching up may not translate into a winning season this year – but they will be playing at a high level (and a new QB) next year.

Comment by markp 10.21.12 @ 6:24 pm

Joe D I got your back. Pitt loses a top recruit and everyone says “Chryst recruits his guys. He doesn’t need top recruits.” Completely lame excuse. Last I looked we are going into a better conference next year with teams like FSU who have top national recruiting classes every year. If Wanny was the Pitt coach and Pitt was in the ACC his recruiting classes would have been amazing. But now look at Chryst’s recruits a bunch of lower dudes. You can never have enough talent. The whole he recruits his guys is just what bad recruiters say. You won’t see Jumbo Fisher or Nick Saban saying oh I got these two star guys because they fit and that 5 star I lost didn’t it so who cares.

Lots of people are saying Chryst can coach offense. Really can he? There are solid receivers and two good rbs. But the team never scores when it matters. The scoring output against Cuse, YSU and Cinci was a joke. Not exactly the best Ds.

Also when you are down TWO scores failing to kick the FG to make it a one possession game is not going for the win. They needed the FG and a TD. Say they get a TD on that drive. They still need at least a FG.

Comment by Wardapalooza 10.21.12 @ 6:42 pm

If Wanny, If Wanny, If Wanny…he’s gone – couldn’t coach. You proved my point – Fisher, Saban, Meyer, all have more experience than PC and it will take time to get the experience plus show some results on the field…your expectations are unrealistic.

Comment by markp 10.21.12 @ 6:53 pm

Did you really just compare the recruiting acumen of a multiple National Championship coach at a perennial and historic football program with that of a first year head coach?

Wow…maybe the Penn State and WVU fans were right all of these years…we really do have the most delusional fan base in America.

Comment by ECH 10.21.12 @ 6:55 pm

Boys were just saving it up to knock Mr. Kelly out of the NC picture

Comment by alcofan 10.21.12 @ 7:03 pm

You know what I’m sick of this bullshit I keep hearing regarding Chryst’s ability to coach an offense. ARE YOU KIDDING ME?! What are you people watching when Pitt plays?! HAVE YOU SEEN THE EFFIN O-LINE. IT’S HORRENDOUS. COMPLETELY TERRIBLE! There is no time for Tino and no holes for the running backs. Chryst’s offenses worked fine with a good O-LINE. He doesn’t have that here in the least bit. If you do not realize this then I seriously question your football intelligence. Everyone who says this team is loaded with talent is completely correct. The problem is that all of it lies in the skill positions. There is no talent on the o-line. None. That could be coaching too, but I highly doubt that considering their past success. I mean shit, Tino became a somewhat decent QB and the team still sucks. This season, 5-7. This season if we had a decent O-line, 8-4.

Comment by Timmeh 10.21.12 @ 7:18 pm

Sorry, this season is just so upsetting…

Comment by Timmeh 10.21.12 @ 7:26 pm

Another semi-popular argument is that this team is not talented. I disagree. It certainly is more talented than YSU & Syracuse.

Let’s take a look at who is on the defense for example.

4 star Aaron Donald
4 star Todd Thomas 4 star Tyrone Ezelle
4 star Cullen Christian 3 star Darryl Render
4 star LaFayette Pitts 3 star LaQuentin Smith
3 star Jack Lippert 4 star Ejuan Price
3 star Manny Williams 3 star Jared Holley
3 star Eric Williams 4 star Bryan Murphy
3 star Ray Vinopal 4 star TJ Clemmings
3 star K’Wuan Williams 4 star Nick Grigsby
4 star K. Mosely-Smith 3 star Rod Ryles
3 star Bam Bradley 3 star Terrel Jackson
3 star Jamal Pardner 3 star Devon Porchia
4 star Daysean Rippy 3 star Shane Gordon
4 star Dan Mason 3 star Brandon Ifill

I’m sure I missed a few, however if you look at
who we have, there is NO WAY we are less talented than a D2 team (YSU) nor Syracuse. And if you compared ours above with Cincy or L-Ville, we more than likely have more talent than them too !

Don’t have time to look at the offense right now, but I’m sure it’s similar. This program while it has been mismanaged from above (Stevie Cornhole), still has lots of talent in the system and had been to 4 straight bowl games from 2008-2012.
It was not a program in total shambles.

So this notion that we don’t have a talent is bogus.


Comment by Emel 10.21.12 @ 7:27 pm

Sir Tino is NOT a decent QB.

Decent 5th year senior QB’s do not score 17 points and lose against a D2 team, 3 points against Cincy (not going to count the last meaningless mercy TD in the last minute), one TD against crappy Syracuse, and one TD against even lower Buffalo (not going to count the first TD in the 2nd quarter since we got the ball at the UB 27 after a Hendricks interception and Sir Tino didn’t even throw one pass in that 27 yard, 9 play TD drive, he just handed off)

He hasn’t progressed much since that very first start against Utah, when he couldn’t make a play that a good or decent QB could make. Stared down his WR so much, that it was an easy pick in OT. You could see it then (or at least some of us could), and if you can’t see it now, 33 games later, oy vey !

Thank God this era in PITT football is coming to a merciful end.

Veritas et Virtus !

Comment by Emel 10.21.12 @ 7:54 pm

EMel you are right so what is wrong.
if the talent is there WTF why is penn state 5 and 2 with a first year coach and us so bad.

is it the asst coachs really becuse on paper we should not be this bad.

somebody make sence of this for me i just dont get it.

and once agein you have all said it is a bad OL
but once agein i will point out chryst is not recruiting any better OL than wanny maybe even less OL men so how do you fix a bad OL WHEN YOU CANT SIGN ANY.

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.21.12 @ 9:18 pm

Shame on you EMEL, you’re gonna be called a griper!!! How dare you tell the truth!!!

Didn’t you know, not allowed to say the truth, especially if that truth is not good.

That’s negativity, that’s a no-no!!!

Comment by Dan 10.21.12 @ 9:35 pm

Saying that Pitt is playing better is maybe the most idiotic thing I’ve ever heard. They were embarrassingly bad against Buffalo.

Comment by Mike 10.21.12 @ 9:36 pm

EMEL, I suggest you count to three, rub your belly in a circular fashion, start singing kumbaya in falsetto, and Pitt will win 10 games next year!!!

Comment by Dan 10.21.12 @ 9:38 pm

“27 yard, 9 play touchdown drive” LMAO!!

Comment by Dan 10.21.12 @ 9:41 pm

DAN i would have helped you with burg1972 but i was off line i just now saw it when reading old post tonight and you were right i was just calling it as i saw it just like dockish burgh1972 should read dockish.

isnet it funny dan and EMel if we see things and point them out we are the bad ones some fans fallow like sheep you are a good frend DAN you and EMEL and boosdraws and DR. tom we love pitt but we wont fallow like blind sheep

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.21.12 @ 9:50 pm

DAN i am stubborn and determined just how
stubborn am i
i once turned down a job makeing twice what i was makeing this was 35 years ago becuse the man wanted me to shave my beard i would not do it.
the point is i love pitt but if i see things that i think are not right i will say so .

a coach is not god do you remmber when i said no slack for TG half the posters on here thought i was the devil than they chanded there minds and thought TG was was the devil.

aftrer all we all have different thoughts dont we

we are not comminust

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.21.12 @ 10:36 pm

Enough talk about fball. Let get the hoops season started! I’ll pay attention to fball again when spring ball starts up. It will be the post Tino era ans I will be happy again. We will have another year of the guys knowing PC’s system and finally a QB we can count on to make plays more than Tino. Til then, let’s go Steve Adams and the Panther hoops team.

Comment by Dish 10.21.12 @ 11:00 pm

EMEL, no offense but just because you are rated a good HS prospect doesn’t translate into how you will perform in College. Maybe you want to rate how they’ve performed at Pitt as a comparison.

Comment by markp 10.21.12 @ 11:11 pm

No problem FRANKCAN, good to see you and emel. I have no problem with 72Burgh either really.

I just thought it was ridiculous he got persoonal with saying you’re negative. I’ve seen you post for years, mostly positive pro Pitt.

We are allowed to criticize aren’t we??? This isn’t Mr. Happy’s world of fun afterall is it???

Then when he commented back, and used the word pathetic, I thought, time to have some fun with him.

Why can some of us be cynical and sarcastic at times, have you been awake, have you followed Pitt football for the last 30 years??? LOL

Frankly, besides all of the snide remarks from both of us, I’m still waiting for his answer, to the question he posed to you.

Two options he said, accept what they have to offer. (mediocrity, not accepting).

Or, work to fix the problem??? I said, other than buying season tickets, donating to the university athletics, and academics, and buying merchandise, just how does a fan go about working on fixing the problem???

I did let him drag me into the gutter, when he used the word pathetic, then questioned my life for spending time on a sports blog day after day,

not to worry Frankcan, I can go to the gutter if need be!!!!!! LMAO

Frank, you have nothing to apologize for, you’re one of the best Pitt fans on here, you bleed blue and gold, and should not be questioned.

Hail To Pitt!!!

Comment by Dan 10.21.12 @ 11:54 pm

Wasn’t Tino Sunseri a consensus 3*?

Comment by CNorwoodAZ 10.22.12 @ 12:05 am

Now that RB clement is gone i bet RB roman clay
gets a offer just a guess i dont know for sure

and for thoes that care i think mark myers has thrown for close to 2000 yards and 18 TD IN 6 games .

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.22.12 @ 1:03 am

We won. We were the better team. I got what I expected in this game. Now on to Temple and a chance for 500 and some momentum leading into the ND game. I’ll be in Da Burgh to see this game. Hopefully, the weather won’t be like Buffalo and Pitt will deliver. The Rutgers and ND games will tell us if this team is improving and if we have a chance next year in the ACC. If I was a recruit, I would pay close attention to those games. That means you Dorian and Robert.

Comment by TX Panther 10.22.12 @ 7:59 am

TX Panther..
if the recruitment of Foster and Johnson hinges on how we do in Rutgers and ND game…
then consider them OSU commits!!!

Comment by Joe D 10.22.12 @ 8:30 am

Joe D,

Meyer is a tenacious recruiter and I do not expect either to end up at Pitt.

As you said various times, Chryst just doesn’t have the closing skills. We have a void on the oline and dline that should be the priority not a safety who plays in a low division with 4.75 speed, what are they thinking?

Comment by WLAT and The Big Beat 10.22.12 @ 8:45 am


Where did Myers end up? I tried keeping an eye out for an update on his transfer out, but I’m not on most of the other boards, so apparently I missed it.

Comment by Stoosh 10.22.12 @ 9:22 am

Stoosh: Div3 John Carroll

Comment by ECH 10.22.12 @ 9:49 am

Ever since Chryst uttered the words at his first pressor..
“just offer”….
did anyone have any doubt that Chryst can’t land the big recruit…
Right now… Chapman and Orndoff are the only big time recruits…
Foster and Johnson are doubtful…
and Chapman is shaky (don’t be surprised if he decommits)

Comment by Joe D 10.22.12 @ 10:00 am


I don’t think anyone who threw out anything from 6-6 to 8-4 as preseason predictions were out of line. This depth chart had a ton of question marks through it. That was compounded by the fact that many of these kids were dealing with their third system in as many years, and THAT was compounded by the fact that none of has had any idea how they would respond to this coaching staff.

On offense, the running game hasn’t been the strength it was expected to be. It’s safe to say that the offensive line has under-performed, given some of the veteran presence there. Ironically, perhaps the biggest question marks on offense heading into the season – QB and WR – have been among the most productive to this point, but even that progress is stunted a little by Sunseri’s and lack of intangibles and inability to deliver in clutch situations.

On defense, we knew Donald would be solid, but his production may have dipped in large part because the other linemen haven’t elevated their games. Reed discussed the lack of experience at the LB position at length. The perceived strength that was the defensive backfield struggled at first but has taken steps to get better gradually.

As I said in a previous response, the YSU loss was absolutely indefensible. The Syracuse loss was tough to swallow because of all the missed opportunities there. This team, by all accounts, should really be 5-2 right now. Fans SHOULD be disappointed about that. I don’t blame anyone who is. I am as well.

I agree with a lot of what both you and dhuffdaddy posted above, particularly at the QB position. I am beginning to wonder how the coaching staff sees it – whether they’re at the point that wins and bowl eligibility this year mean less than actively preparing your roster coming back for next year.

To this point, they’re 3-4 with three winnable games on the schedule (Temple, UConn, USF). If they were to happen to lose this weekend or to UConn coming off what I think will be a loss at ND, I think that has to become a very real option at that point.

I think the points you both raised regarding Savage and his injury history are valid. I’m not sure where Voytik is in terms of his command of the playbook, but I WOULD like to see something from either he or Anderson this year, whether that comes in some sort of blowout win or loss.

I like the idea of coming back with Savage, Voytik, Anderson and (hopefully) Chapman next year, but there’s big-time potential for a repeat of 2007 when Stull got hurt in the opener and Wanny was forced to go to Kevan Smith/Pat Bostick.

Comment by Stoosh 10.22.12 @ 10:15 am

Corey Clement has been waffling for months. He probably saw the writing on the wall. Shell is the starter for the forseeable future here. Of all positions, RB is the least of my worries for this team.

I can barely stand to read the comments here anymore. This site used to be the last bastion of reasoned debate as far as Pitt forums. Pantherlair and Dokish’s blog are full of kneejerkers who would rather just spit fire and namecall than have a real discussion. Now they are all here too. It’s a shame.

Comment by JCE 10.22.12 @ 10:17 am

Ye of little faith. If everyone expects Pitt to lose in South Bend, that’s when Pitt will pleasantly surprise. Watch for it.

Comment by TX Panther 10.22.12 @ 10:19 am

Corey just freed up a recruit for a PON (Position of Need). Need more linemen…not RB’s.

Comment by TX Panther 10.22.12 @ 10:21 am

the day Clement decommitted…
Pitt got a verbal from a 2 star RB/Safety out of Maryland… 4.75 speed… plays in lowest level of Maryland HS football.
C’mon man!!

Comment by Joe D 10.22.12 @ 10:33 am

Stoosh that total for myers was for five games he was out hurt for one game. some of his TD were for over 60 yd.
but the best part if you remmber they said he could not throw short some of his TD were for 10 yd that to me is a short throw of course for tino that would be a long throw.

he has had a 5 TD game and 6 TD game and over 450 yd in both games
relevant every thing is relevant they will say the D is no good in div 3 but the WR and the OL are not eather so it is all relevant or eaqual

i dont think myers lacked talent i think he did not pratice well maybe partyed to mutch
but if a QB gets a real shot at the pros my bet is on myers not tino.
he never got a real shot in a game he never played a whole Quater or a half some people are not pratice players he was in for what 2 series one or twice you cant tell from that he pissed the coachs off that would be my guess when he was at pitt.

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.22.12 @ 10:35 am

Frankcan: I think you need to temper your Mark Myers post-partem depression a little. His gaudy numbers are much more a function of the level of football he is playing than the skills he was unable to unleash at the D1 level.

You can’t tell me that 3 head coaches and a half-dozen offensive coordinators chose to simply ignore him on the practice field because he pissed them off. He had great “measurables” but very good stuff on the field. That combination gets you a clipboard every time.

Comment by ECH 10.22.12 @ 10:43 am

* but NOT very good stuff on the field.


Comment by ECH 10.22.12 @ 10:43 am

I can’t believe Mark Myers is still coming up here. Division I football and where he is playing now are apples and oranges — not even RELATIVE. I am sure you could find dozens of other QB’s at that level with similar stats. That doesn’t mean they can play D-I football. The bottoom line is that Myers had an opportunity at Pitt should he have chosen to take advantage of it. He did not. Don’t blame the coaches. If he pissed the coaches off, that is on him. You do not piss coaches off by practicing and performing well, and following team rules. Enough about Myers. Please.

Comment by JCE 10.22.12 @ 10:51 am

we will know for sure when he is drafted in the pros if he does not make it you are right if he makes it i am we will see in a year or 2

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.22.12 @ 10:53 am

Change of subject – I think it’s time for Hillgrove to move on with his life’s work in announcing. Actually listened to the tv broadcasters instead of the radio broadcast Saturday. Seemed like he constantly lost track of downs, players, and even the team’s name (2 separate occasions referred to Buffalo as the Bills). For a HOF broadcaster, he’s unfortunately seen his skills fall off. Can’t stand to listen to the Yinzer Nation during Steelers games…

Comment by The Big A 10.22.12 @ 10:56 am

@ FRANKCAN, as well as Emel, Dan and any other critics out there on the current status of Pitt football. FRANKCAN dropped my name when he made mention of “following like blind sheep”. I’m not sure of the reference since I see no one here ignoring the obvious deficits in Pitt’s football program right now.

After Saturday’s win I didn’t hear anybody struttin around with their chest’s puffed out chantin “we bad, we bad”. Other than you guys, but you were defining “bad” is in that, “we stink”.

We’ll we do stink right now, but we smell better than the Buffalo Bulls today. Yes, the less bad team won on Saturday. No one is calling Pitt’s victory a turn around game!

You have the option of being critical of Pitt’s performance, pointing out the weaknesses that were evident and sulking around like we lost the game if you would like to.

But the facts are, we won the game on Saturday in misirable weather conditions and there were some bright spots in that game, besides just winning, that you could appreciate, if you chose to.

You guys can chose to be the pessimists, I can chose to be the optimist. If you bother to check my previous posts, you’ll see that I called this year’s record as anywhere from 3-9 to 9-3. Well at 3-4 I’m in that range already, so we can only go up from here.

Now am I confident that Pitt is on the right track, no I’m not. Do I have answers to Pitt’s problems, no I don’t. I’m I ignoring the obvious issues that Pitt’s future success depends on, no I’m not. Do I HOPE for the best for the Program however, YES I DO. If that makes me a blind sheep, well then I guess that I am, but that doesn’t make me a baaaaaaad person. LOL

Comment by Dr. Tom 10.22.12 @ 10:58 am

I try to see some good in everything and try to avoid being confrontational. I do wish the staff would focus more on recruiting linemen given depth issues. And many recruits are probably turned off because there is little stability in the program given all the coaching changes. Yes, the future is bright with the ACC but Chryst will need to find dynamic recruiters in this footprint to be successful. Pitt can still impress this year by finishing strong and knocking off the Domers in South Bend. Stop being Debbie Downers. It would have been nice to win the Big East and go to a BCS game on our way out but it wasn’t meant to be. I’m trying to enjoy the rest of the season. The negative postings are a beat down.

Comment by TX Panther 10.22.12 @ 11:13 am

A WVU fan was on a radio show saying he took his grand daughter the first time to the game Saturday. He said he will not go back because fans were so drunk they were falling down and cursing non stop.

Maybe we can say not so at Pitt games.

Comment by Frank MD 10.22.12 @ 11:18 am

DR TOM the blind sheep was for burgh72
how could you think it was for you you must have read someting wrong. you know we all love you.
and you have been a down on them at times just like us but only when they need it,

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.22.12 @ 12:27 pm

that was for the posters who slam us if we dont think every thing is bright and sunny who think chryst is a god.

Comment by FRANKCAN 10.22.12 @ 12:34 pm

Dr.Tom, you need to re-read FRANKCANS post, he was inlcuding you as a great Pitt fan, but, who also points out things that are bad.

It was a compliment, not throwing you under the bus.

Comment by Dan 10.22.12 @ 1:00 pm

@ Dr. Tom
I give out praise when & where it is warranted.
If you scroll up, you’ll see I praised PITT’s defense for bending, but not breaking in the W on Saturday. In which I also specifically mentioned the play of Dan Mason & Jason Hendricks.

What I attempt to do sometimes on the other hand is disspell some of these notions that there is no talent on this team and that this program was in some sort of doormat total rebuilding stage.

Just a few short years ago we had our best 3 year run in 30 years and finished 2009 ranked #15.
We have been to 4 straight bowl games. There is plenty of talent on this team to be 5-2. No way we should have lost to Youngstown State or Syracuse. Now if that is griping or pissing some ppl off. Too bad !

Comment by EMel 10.22.12 @ 6:42 pm

Whoa, easy there EMEL. That’s a little too close to saying Wanny did a good job. Are you trying to get the haters all stirred up?

Comment by marcus of schaumburg 10.22.12 @ 7:18 pm

lol marcus, God forbid !

*sends marcus a private email suggesting that Wanny did do a good job. Facts are facts. Wins are wins and final poll rankings as in #15 in 2009 are rankings. And that team was two points and one Janocko from being Top 10 and Sugar Bowl bound.
My only beef with Wanny was installing Sir Tino as QB based on nepotism, legacy and all that garbage.

Comment by Emel 10.22.12 @ 7:44 pm

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