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July 23, 2012

NCAA On PSU Open Thread

Filed under: Football,NCAA,Police Blotter,Scandal — Chas @ 7:47 am

Well, it has been an active 24 hours or so, hasn’t it?

The Joe Paterno statue has been removed. Reports swirl of unprecedented sanctions from the NCAA — that Penn State won’t fight — and quickly verbal commits start hedging on their future.

NCAA President Mark Emmert is going to be conducting a press conference this morning at 9am to lay things out on Penn State. This is all uncharted territory, but everything about this Penn State scandal is uncharted territory for college athletics and the NCAA.

Yahoo Sports reported on Sunday, citing two sources, that Mr. Emmert has been able to skip the normal enforcement procedure as part of a provision allowed in the NCAA constitution by getting permission from the NCAA’s board of directors. The board comprises 18 university presidents and chancellors.

Coincidentally, former Penn State president Graham Spanier endorsed the need for swift decisions by the board, like the type it has reportedly taken, at a summit of NCAA presidents last August.

“The board needs to be prepared to take stronger actions directly,” he said.

We’ll all find out in just a short while. Twitter may break on this one.

 

 





It finally looks like PSU realizes they need swift and strong action to put this behind them and get off the front page. I am sure the NCAA wants the same thing.

The next thing we might hear is how the perpetrators settle out of court and take their medicine. A sensational court case keeps all of this on the front page.

Comment by gc 07.23.12 @ 7:55 am

Even though this would be just a symbolic penalty by the NCAA, I would not be surprised, in the least, if the NCAA had Penn State forfeit all wins that occurred after the cover-up was initiated. This would lower the boom on Penn State’s football historical perspective forever. When their record is reviewed in the future, even decades from now, it will always jump off the page that Penn State had NO wins for over a decade. The memory of this awful cover-up debacle will then always be remembered because the answer to that question of continuous losing seasons will be obvious from this time forward.

Comment by Dr. Tom 07.23.12 @ 8:16 am

Vacating winns also takes Joe’s name out of the NCAA record books. I bet it happens.

Comment by pittstadiumshuffle 07.23.12 @ 8:49 am

wow the wins are gone… I didnt see that one coming.

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 9:12 am

I think the scholarships could have taken a bigger hit. 25 to 15, could have been much worse

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 9:13 am

They got off easy. No surprise.

Comment by pittstadiumshuffle 07.23.12 @ 9:19 am

Ditka I believe it is 10 this upcoming year (2013 recruits) and 20 per year for four year…

Penn State will feel this for a long time.

Comment by Reed 07.23.12 @ 9:20 am

Breaking news: Elite recruits flock to Penn St, fighting hand to hand to secure one of the “Precious 15″ scholarships to PSU. Nittany Lions favored to be Big Ten champions in 2017

Comment by TartanPanther 07.23.12 @ 9:20 am

With a squad of 60 they’ll be competitive in 7 on 7 ball

Comment by steve1 07.23.12 @ 9:21 am

holy shit, the death penalty would have been a lighter penalty. good for the ncaa for having some balls to stand up and say society is more important than sports. and i thought they did a great job prefacing it with the justification of why they had the right to pass judgement for all the psu fans who doubted that this act could be governed by the ncaa. not a good day to be a penn state fan, joe pa no longer is winningest coach. interesting to see now if players transfer or stay put.

Comment by pittisit37 07.23.12 @ 9:22 am

These sanctions are surely severe. Emmert deserves cudos for acting swiftly. But I wonder what this says about the future use of the death penalty.

The rationale for not imposing the death penalty here(too much collateral damage)would apply to any major school. THis tells me that the death penalty would likely never be imposed again. Wonder how SMU feels about that.

Comment by dinosaur 71 07.23.12 @ 9:27 am

ESPN has a summary.

link to espn.go.com

Comment by JCE 07.23.12 @ 9:28 am

THIS IS THE BIGGEST LOAD OF BULLSHIT.

4 EFFING YEARS?

I DONT GIVE TWO SHITS ABOUT VACATING WINS.

$60M ARE YOU EFFING KIDDING ME!!!!

Comment by H.LandPitt 07.23.12 @ 9:30 am

There seems to be confusion with the scholarship reduction. Some sites say reduction of 10/year, others say 10 initial, then 20/year. This to me is important to evaluate the severity of the punishment. Big difference between 40 and 90 with regard to scholarship reductions.

Comment by Jason 07.23.12 @ 9:31 am

It’s 10 initial and 10 current scholarships they lose for four years. That hurts. It means they have to be spot on in recruiting — everyone they get has to be a big player. But the bowl ban works against that. And add in a $60 million fine, and they’re screwed.

Supposedly, PSU didn’t know this was coming so couldn’t consent to it. I wouldn’t be surprised to see litigation over this, particularly the $60 million. There was no due process hearing, and I wonder if the NCAA has the authority to level a fine like this. And where does the $60 million come from? Pennsylvania taxpayers? A hellacious tuition increase?

I think PSU would’ve rather had the death penalty for a year.

Comment by velvil 07.23.12 @ 9:31 am

Why would the players decommit? They chose to go to SCHOOL at Penn State. The SCHOOL and the football team still exist. Let’s see how many ‘student athletes” are truly committed to the university.

Comment by pittstadiumshuffle 07.23.12 @ 9:32 am

Shuting the program down for this season along w/the ncaa sanctions would have been appropriate action considering the serious nature of the situation ==

Comment by DC33 07.23.12 @ 9:33 am

15 scholarships per year for 4 years

Comment by wbb 07.23.12 @ 9:36 am

Nothing stated about TV appearances?

Joe Paterno is now the 8th winningest coach in NCAA history. I wonder if Bill O’Brien tries to get out of his contract now?

And let the feeding frenzy commence.

Comment by Pitt Is It!!! 07.23.12 @ 9:38 am

Its going to be 20 scholarships spread over 4 years.

Comment by pittstadiumshuffle 07.23.12 @ 9:40 am

Who would have guessed that Pitt would have a better record over the last 13 years than Penn St.?

Comment by 66Goat 07.23.12 @ 9:40 am

With regard to scholarship reduction….See my confusion?

Comment by Jason 07.23.12 @ 9:41 am

On the issue of scholarships, they are only permitted 65 schollies per year for 4 years (a reduction of the total per year by 20 per year). Also, they are only permitted 15 new scholarships per year for 4 years (a reduction of the maximum per year by 10 per year). That is a HUGE scholarship reduction, and with everything else constitutes the most severe penalty ever imposed by the NCAA. That’s 80 total scholarships, $60 million fine, 4 year bowl ban, and 14 years of vacated wins. Wow.

Comment by Sean 07.23.12 @ 9:41 am

note that if a college (say Pitt) takes in a PSU transfer, it does not count against the schollie limit of the school.

Comment by wbb 07.23.12 @ 9:41 am

Did you hear the continued reference to ‘hero worship’ in the presser? An obvious refernce to the PSU students and fans who still feel JoePa did can do no wrong

Comment by wbb 07.23.12 @ 9:44 am

I really think vacating the wins was unnecessary. As it stands now, it is a death penalty, for the Penn State football program. With everything else that has happened to date, it appears to me that the NCAA is piling on. I was not a Joe Paterno fan, because his ending of an over a century old rivalry, but I think the NCAA went overboard on this one. Can you imagine what kind of background checks universities will do on employees from here on in?

Comment by Justinian 07.23.12 @ 9:45 am

I think Velvil has the scholarship count correct – it is 10 right away, plus 10 more each of the next 4 year, which means they are essentially down 20 scholarships each of the next 4 years. I agree that this is potentially crippling, but could have been worse.

Also, PSU has already consented to these penalties, so there will be no challenge. I can’t imagine anybody but PSU would have standing to challenge them.

Comment by Pantherman13 07.23.12 @ 9:45 am

The NCAA does not want Joe Paterno’s name in its record books for most wins; hence vacating the wins.

Comment by pittstadiumshuffle 07.23.12 @ 9:47 am

Justinian – the vacating of the wins appears to be the NCAA’s way of removing Paterno’s name from its record books. I agree that it is a highly symbolic gesture, but ironically, it may be the thing that gets the most attention from the Paterno worshippers.

Evan Royster had an interesting tweet earlier – something along the lines of “oh crap…so I lost every college football game I ever played in?”.

Comment by Pantherman13 07.23.12 @ 9:49 am

Fines don’t send a message. Losing some scholarships doesn’t send a message. Missing a few bowl games doesn’t send a message.

Bob Ryan of the Boston Globe said it best. I’m paraphrasing, but he said Penn State needs to cancel football for a couple years to show the rest of us that they know why they exist, and that they don’t exist only for several festive Saturdays every fall.

This penalty won’t do anything to change a culture that enabled Sandusky.

Comment by hugh green 07.23.12 @ 9:50 am

The vacated wins were a good shot to the gut for the JoePa family and the penn state egos.

Once I see some clarification on the scholarships then we’ll see how serve this penalty really is or is not.

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 9:51 am

The entire fiasco was due to Paterno’s relentless pursit of wins. I thought the wins would be the first thing to go, personally.

Comment by apostles03 07.23.12 @ 9:51 am

Vacating the wins was surprising, but overall I thought they got off light. Really wanted to see a TV ban for all football games for 4-5 years. Making the PSU football team “go away” for this length of time really would have changed the culture. They still get exposure, I would have limited this exposure.

Comment by pittbluegold 07.23.12 @ 9:52 am

Pantherman, how do subtract 10 from 25 and come up with 20?

Comment by wbb 07.23.12 @ 9:53 am

I just heard the scholarship situation explained on espn and still don’t have any clue. All I heard was a limit of 65 scholarships, I guess that is over four years?

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 9:54 am

NCAA really covered all bases on this one. Their intent was to “allow Penn St to focus on what is important”.

1) 60 million fine
2) reduction from 25 to 15 scholarships per year (reduction of 10 scholarship offer per year for 4 years or a total of 40 scholarships). Currently the max scholarships total for any given season is 85. Allowing only 15 per season over 4 years means that the pain will be felt beyond 4 years. In year 4 PSU will only be playing with a team that has at Max 60 scholarship plerers

3) 4 year post season ban. Damaging for sure. (Don’t be surprised if the B10 limits revenue sharing during that time)

4) vacating wins from 2008 – 2011 means that JPaterno is no longer the winningest coach in NCAAA D1 history

5) AND THE MOST DAMAGING OF ALL…. All current players are eligible to transfer immediately with out penalty. They can play now. The phones are ringing as I type.

This one will knock PSU down the ladder for at least the next 5-6 years conservatively. The Death Penalty would have been less of a penalty for sure.

History will only tell if these sanctions have the same impact on PSU as they did on SMU. My guess is that they will.

The new PSU coach just signed up for a dead end job. No other way to look at it.

Comment by Pitt Fan in Atlanta 07.23.12 @ 9:54 am

Pantherman, I take back that comment above … but still don’t understandf what you mean by “down 20 scholarships each of the next 4 years.”

Comment by wbb 07.23.12 @ 9:55 am

For those who bet against Penn St. in the last 13 years and lost, please see your bookie for a refund.

Comment by 66Goat 07.23.12 @ 9:56 am

Dont forget the Big Ten is going to level its penalties against the state penn at 11am…

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 9:57 am

Coach O’Brien (1) is well paid, (2) should have known of the pending dangers, and (3) is ina very sympathetic position with low expectations.

Comment by wbb 07.23.12 @ 9:57 am

I wonder how that Top 10 recruiting class is feeling right about now?

Comment by Pitt Is It!!! 07.23.12 @ 9:59 am

wbb – it’s that new math that the kids learn nowadays that I never really got!

Seriously, my reference was to the effective reduction in total scholarships to 65 per year, which is 20 below the 85 limit.

Comment by Pantherman13 07.23.12 @ 10:02 am

Pantherman, I realize that, but it seems unusually vindictive. They were worried more about the university and the reputation of the football program when Joe PA, Curley and Spanier swept things under the rug in the first place. Cover-ups tend to have an explosive effect when discovered. The university will pay a heavy price for that decision, I just think the NCAA to be politically correct, is piling on.

Comment by Justinian 07.23.12 @ 10:02 am

Let me add to the scholarship confusion. I get the reduction from 25 to 15 for New scholarships but was under the impression the 20 per year means they can have no more than 65 Scholarship players on the roster. Is that right or am I missing something?

Comment by giveitarest 07.23.12 @ 10:04 am

If the notion that PSU can only have 65 scholarships at any time over the next four years that would me they can’t take any at all in the 2013 class, correct?

Since they have 85 right now?

Comment by Reed 07.23.12 @ 10:06 am

giveitarest – I believe you are correct. Total limit of 65 per year. I think they have to be down to 75 this fall, then when the 15-scholly limit kicks in for the next recruiting class, the limit will be 65.

Comment by Pantherman13 07.23.12 @ 10:06 am

From ESPN:

“Penn State must also reduce 10 initial and 20 total scholarships each year for a four-year period.”

link to es.pn

Comment by velvil 07.23.12 @ 10:07 am

according to ESPN
“With the wins from 1998-2011 vacated, Paterno drops from 409 wins to 298, dropping him from first to 12th on the winningest NCAA football coach list. Penn State will also have six bowl wins and two conference championships erased.”

Comment by Pitt Fan in Atlanta 07.23.12 @ 10:08 am

The NCAA wants cultural change at Penn State. 5 year probation and implementation of a Compliance office. They didn’t give the death penalty because it would have impacted too many innocent people. That’s code for it would have been economically devastating to State College. The cult will still survive after all this. They will just find someone else to hero worship and football will continue to be placed first. They’ll just do a better job at covering up things next time. I doubt the new controls and oversight will have much of an impact on how things get done between the athletic and academic departments. The death penalty would have killed the cult and provided a foundation for true structural and cultural change. Pedo State got off easy if you ask me.

Comment by TX Panther 07.23.12 @ 10:10 am

Look guys – the PSU administration is taking all these SEVERE penalties without a mere peep of rebuttal. They must know something about the whole situation – ie what is still left uncovered, that is FAR worse than imaginable.

Comment by giffer-in-Htown 07.23.12 @ 10:11 am

Here is the NCAA official releases on the sanctions

link to ncaa.org

Comment by Reed 07.23.12 @ 10:11 am

They got off easy when you consider that this coverup went beyond athletics and included spanier up to the trustee that recently quit. I wanted a death penalty to ensure football at any university never becomes bigger than protecting the kids and education.

Comment by pittfan92 07.23.12 @ 10:11 am

We are missing a very important piece of information in all of these sanctions…does Pitt pick up a win or two because of all of the vacated wins?

Comment by OrlandoAlum 07.23.12 @ 10:11 am

i said last night they would lose 10 scholarships a year for 4 years and i was right they will lose 40 scholarship over 4 years. i also said 3 year bowl ban i missed that bye i year
not a bad guess bye me.
i did not see the wins being takeing away.

Comment by FRANKCAN 07.23.12 @ 10:13 am

I never envisioned the severity of the penalties. It’s the end of Penn State Football, as we knew it.

Comment by Justinian 07.23.12 @ 10:14 am

Very nice piece in the PG by Mark Dent

“What I found to be extremely telling … is the janitors,” said Louis Freeh, the former FBI director who directed the investigation at the behest of university trustees. “The janitors, that’s the tone on the bottom. These are the employees of Penn State who clean and maintain locker rooms in the Lasch Building where the young boys are being raped. They witnessed probably the most horrific rape that’s described. And what do they do? They panic.

“They said we can’t report this because we’ll get fired. They knew who Sandusky was. One of the janitors watched him growing up as the defensive coach. They were afraid to take on the football program. They said the university would circle around it. … If that’s the culture on the bottom, then God help the culture on top.”

Read more: link to post-gazette.com

Comment by Pitt Fan in Atlanta 07.23.12 @ 10:15 am

The death penalty might be easier (although the financial impact to the BIG10 may have played into the decision not to). It hits PSU on several time frames:

$60 million (paid now?) is the equivalent of 1 year revenue from football

4 year Scholarships and bowl bans effectively disable the program for at least 6 years until they get back on their feet.

And the wins do not hurt the program financially or performance wise BUT its a shot to the gut. Its permanent. No longer can you claim Paterno’s or PSU’s record with pride. From a football point of view this is a reminder of what happened. 100 years from now someone whow may not know the story will see the missing wins in the record books and ask why.

Comment by pittfan6 07.23.12 @ 10:15 am

“Four-year reduction of grants-in-aid. For a period of four years commencing with the 2013-2014 academic year and expiring at the conclusion of the 2016-2017 academic year, the NCAA imposes a limit of 15 initial grants-in-aid (from a maximum of 25 allowed) and for a period of four years commencing with the 2014-2015 academic year and expiring at the conclusion of the 2017-2018 academic year a limit of 65 total grants-in-aid (from a maximum of 85 allowed) for football during each of those specified years. In the event the total number of grants-in-aid drops below 65, the University may award grants-in-aid to non-scholarship student-athletes who have been members of the football program as allowed under Bylaw 15.5.6.3.6.”

Comment by Reed 07.23.12 @ 10:15 am

Orlando I believe they would

1998 we lost 20-13
1999 we lost 20-17

Two more wins for Walt!

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 10:16 am

Orlando Alum, You forget, Joe PA ended the series, so it will have no effect on the Panther win column.

Comment by Justinian 07.23.12 @ 10:16 am

It isn’t over yet, guys. Still a long way to go down this rabbit hole. The NCAA has spoken, the Big Ten will speak later today, but the courts will be speaking for a long time to come.

Comment by thestumper 07.23.12 @ 10:17 am

I stand corrected, Coach Ditka.

Comment by Justinian 07.23.12 @ 10:18 am

Found this on the NCAA site help clear up the scholarship confusion or at least mine

Four-year reduction of grants-in-aid. For a period of four years commencing with the 2013-2014 academic year and expiring at the conclusion of the 2016-2017 academic year, the NCAA imposes a limit of 15 initial grants-in-aid (from a maximum of 25 allowed) and for a period of four years commencing with the 2014-2015 academic year and expiring at the conclusion of the 2017-2018 academic year a limit of 65 total grants-in-aid (from a maximum of 85 allowed) for football during each of those specified years. In the event the total number of grants-in-aid drops below 65, the University may award grants-in-aid to non-scholarship student-athletes who have been members of the football program as allowed under Bylaw 15.5.6.3.6.

Comment by giveitarest 07.23.12 @ 10:18 am

Previous record against Ped St: 42-50-4
Guess we now pick up two wins in 98 & 99: 44-48-4
We’ll likely pick up two more in 16 & 17: 46-48-4

Comment by pittbluegold 07.23.12 @ 10:18 am

From the above it looks like 15 for this 2013 recruiting season.

Then after that they have a limit of 15 per year BUT at no time can they be over 65 scholarship players on the roster from 2014-2017.

This means that unless there are mass defections PSU won’t even be able to offer 15 per year.

At least that’s what I think it is. The key is not being able to have more than 65 scholarships on the roster for four years.

This is a big deal.

Comment by Reed 07.23.12 @ 10:19 am

what this means is penn state can have 2 more commits this year which will give them a total of 15 if any one will go there and if the commit that are there stay.

Comment by FRANKCAN 07.23.12 @ 10:22 am

Reed, A very big deal. They will have a football program in name only. There is no way they can compete in the Big Ten. Indiana won’t be at the bottom of the conference.

Comment by Justinian 07.23.12 @ 10:25 am

I don’t think the vacating of wins means that Pitt picks up any wins, more likely we just drop any losses from our record.

I’m sure Florida State will be first in line to sort out that issue – since they have Bowden’s statue to update with regard to wins and losses.

Comment by PittDan 07.23.12 @ 10:29 am

Never was a PSU or JoePa fan, but think the NCAA is beyond their scope.
My theory is this is what the PSU board decided and had the NCAA be the bad guy not them. Just like making the statue a President decision not the boards. This wimpy board should all go.

Comment by Jimbo 07.23.12 @ 10:32 am

They got off easy! I am disgusted with the NCAA…but what else is new. Should have gotten a 2 year death penalty..then start fresh. To even have them in uniform this Fall is a victory for pedophiles everywhere.

Comment by Dan 72 07.23.12 @ 10:35 am

The Big 10 and schools like Pitt could apply the “coup de grace” by simply refusing to play PSU in any sport, but especially football, starting immediately. That would eliminate PSU football forever…an appropo penalty for crimes against humanity!

Comment by Dan 72 07.23.12 @ 10:38 am

Dan, Since they didn’t get the death penalty I felt they could have got hit even harder on the scholarships.

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 10:44 am

The NCAA showed thoughtful consideration for the thousands of innocent individuals that will be severely impacted by their decisions for “Punitive and Corrective actions” against penn state.

The “culture” at penn state is the problem, not necessarily just college football. Life goes on and so should penn state football. What will be learned from this is the question that remains to be answered.

But, the penn ptate cultural mindset needs a huge attitude adjustment. Will it happen, only time will tell.

However all of the actions taken today by the NCAA were well thought out and targeted to not only address the essential need for such cultural shifts in attitudes of those associated with institutions of higher education but also established a platform, as well as a funding source for this platform, to help into the future, victims just like the ones who were impacted by this whole penn state debacle in the first place. No penn state contributor will be able to write a check to that university without fully knowing that a portion of those funds will be going towards paying that $60,000,000 punitive fine.

I’m impressed by the NCAA’s actions today. They have attempted to minimise the “collateral damage” that will impact the innocents affected by penn state football but at the same time will have long lasting effects on penn state’s football program into the future. And with the vacating of wins during the time period of the cover-up, the NCAA has imposed a significant historical memorial to the victims of this penn state sexual abuse scandal, while also discrediting the accomplishments of joe paterno and his program during that period as well.

Now how the penn state faithful decide that they want to proceed from here is up to that group of followers, but make no mistake, the NCAA has labeled them as being part of the problem. It is now up to the “we are penn state” people to initiate real change.

(BTW, the lack of upper case letters was intentional, they will remain in lower case for this institution until the people who associate themselves with it have shown me, beyond a shadow of a doubt that they “get it”, accept the transgressions of their institution’s powerful leaders and have internalized and shared the blame for them. Only then will penn state deserve capital letters in my opinion.)

Comment by Dr. Tom 07.23.12 @ 10:46 am

Dan – this is worse than the Death Penalty. The scholarship limits alone kill the program for a long time.

One thing that was made perfectly clear was that there are no limits to the NCAA oversight. This is a voluntary organization whose membership is not required.

Comment by Reed 07.23.12 @ 10:46 am

The funny thing is that in a strange way Penn St needs the PITT PSU game more than ever.
Reasons
1) need the PR in the state for recruits
2) needs a true rivalry more than ever
3) needs to hook their wagon to a positive tradition now mee than ever

Comment by Pitt fan in Atlanta 07.23.12 @ 10:48 am

Espn just had ex-player B Noble do a interview, and boy are the Pedo State football alum clueless.

Comment by Bones 07.23.12 @ 10:50 am

Dan 72 is correct. NCAA should have shut down the progran for @ least 1 year along w/current sanctions.

Comment by DC33 07.23.12 @ 10:50 am

“a victory for pedophiles everywhere”

Surely you can’t be serious? I mean really. Sandusky is off in prison, probably for the rest of his miserable life and hopefully Curley, Schultz and Spanier will more than likely spend some time in prison.

Comment by Pitt Is It!!! 07.23.12 @ 10:50 am

Bones, Michael Robinson was on espn yesterday, again…no clue.

its really amazing how people see right past the severity of the situation and refuse to accept that their God was a sleeze bag.

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 10:55 am

Franco Harris needs to bend over and remove his head from his ass too.

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 10:57 am

Best part of all of this is PSU CONSENTED to the sanctions….and I don’t blame them, because these sanctions are a lot lighter than I initially thought.

Only exception that was harsher than I thought was the vacating of 112 wins….so when it was all said and done Walt Harris beat PSU 3 times…good for him!

Comment by Marco 07.23.12 @ 10:57 am

I agree that this worse than the death penalty. These sanctions will cripple the program for many years to come.

Comment by velvil 07.23.12 @ 11:01 am

Now the number 1 question will any player transfer from penn state and will we pick any of them up if they do.
and can we call them to ask or not what are the rules.

Comment by FRANKCAN 07.23.12 @ 11:02 am

I would like to see half the money go to the victims. The other half into the research of what makes a pedophile. What makes a grown man crave young boys??

You can’t just sit around and say, “well, we’ll deal with it when it happens, and help the victims”.

You have to stop the pedophile before it happens.

Comment by Dan 07.23.12 @ 11:02 am

Think they should have banned all PSU televised games and not allow to play at home for two years. The Big 10 teams would want them gone from conference.
Who cares about previous wins? That’s history!

Comment by T 07.23.12 @ 11:04 am

Bones, I, too, heard the ESPN interview of B Noble, WHAT A NEANDERTHAL HE IS! These knucklehead PSU football players don’t get the fact that they had the throne handed to them while playing there while boys were being raped and the football coach and the university president stood by and kept silent so that these football players could be idolized by the PSU cult and exalted by the sports media as the “model” of what a moral, upstanding football program looks like.

What utter blind, self-centered, arrogant knuckleneads these PSU “Lettermen” are in society today.

Comment by Panther Fan in Hoopieland 07.23.12 @ 11:05 am

looks like the Big Ten basically said no bowl money for four years which equals about $13 mil.

Comment by Coach Ditka 07.23.12 @ 11:15 am

I am in agreeance tha these sanctions may impact the program worse than the death penalty. The Death Penalty would be like ripping off a band-aid…Painful but overwith quickly. These sanctions will slowly compound the pain for the program over the next four-six years. The Death Penalty also has financial and economic ramfifications for the entire State College area. The 60MM fine makes sure PSU pays financially without having a crippling impact on small businesses in the area.

I am interested to see if this “Us against the world” mentality all of the coaches, players, and recruits were touting erodes in the coming months.

As far as PSU accepting the penalties…can you imagine the absolute PR NIGHTMARE if they started challenging the NCAA??

Comment by BCPITT 07.23.12 @ 11:15 am

I am keenly interested in how the Big 10 punishes Pedo State.

Most likely, they won’t share bowl revenues from the conference for those 4 years. And, they may ban their football games from being shown locally on the BTN. TV revenues could be cut as well.

I doubt many Nitter players will transfer or decommit. They love Creepy Valley and are drunk on the Kool Aid.

Comment by TX Panther 07.23.12 @ 11:16 am

Man did Des Howard hit the nail on the head referring to people saying they are punishing the players. He said they have a choice to stay or go. The victims never had a choice.

Comment by Bones 07.23.12 @ 11:20 am

Big 10 ruling is in:

1) they up hold NCAA sanctions
2) prohibited from participating in Big Ten championship for 4 years
3) forfeit bowl money share from B10 for 4 years (approx 13M per yr) with proceed going to charitable fund set up by b10

Reality is that the NCAA sanctions trumped anything that the B10 could impose. It was obvious that depriving them of bowl share was going to occur. The B10 could have shown more courage and taken TV contract money as well. In that sense the B10 protected their own and slapped PSU on the wrist

Comment by Pitt fan in Atlanta 07.23.12 @ 11:21 am

BC, the attitude will change over the coming years, as the losses pile up.

Comment by Justinian 07.23.12 @ 11:23 am

Only time will tell if PSU has learned the lessons. I will keep my beliefs on whether they do to myself.
On another note, I laid into Chris Peak last night on his show. He claimed the NCAA did not have “jurisdiction” over the matter and those who urged harsh punishment from the NCAA were merely trying to pile on PSU.
Peak forgot to mention the NCAA constitution and ability of the NCAA to enforce its own laws.
He also opined that anyone who cares about college sports should be worried if the NCAA levied any type of sanction.
I replied that we should be worried if they did not.
You cannot look past the protection of the football program as the motivating factor for the cover up. It involved the AD, the head coach, an assistant coach (Sandusky was still on staff for a time) and the University President among others.
Scratch me off the Panthair Lair radio listening audience.
Some people just don’t get it and some of the people have nothing to do with PSU.
As for PSU, the process continues and more revelations await.

Comment by sfpitt 07.23.12 @ 11:26 am

What is telling to me is the reaction of the PSU faithful. You can start to understand why there was a cover-up, because the faithful are clueless to anything outside their football team. So you can say the faithful are at fault for creating the environment as well.

Comment by Bones 07.23.12 @ 11:27 am

Penn State essentially took a plea bargain, IMO.

The death penalty would have likely done a better job in cleaning up the culture. Though, it may have also enboldened them, also.

I think this will actually hurt the competitiveness of the football team more than a one-year death penalty would have. They’ll be an I-AA team for 4 years, and then a I-AA team moving to I-A for at least 2 years after that.

Comment by originalether 07.23.12 @ 11:30 am

I get that the whole crime itself was not a football issue, but sfpitt hit the nail on the head!! The cover up and continued abuses were allowed for one and only one purpose, the preservation of the football program. The football culture and program inarguably were involved and greatly impacted the situation. The NCAA isn’t punishing PSU because of what Sandusky did, they are punishing PSU because of what EVERYONE ELSE DID NOT DO.

Comment by BCPITT 07.23.12 @ 11:33 am

My take on the scholarship math….

If they have 15 incoming freshman this fall AND the total scholarships for this fall would be 85 (the normal max), it means the following:

– all 15 incoming scholarships need to be withdrawn AND they have to release 5 more current players from scholarship.

– on the other end of the spectrum, they could keep the incoming (hypothetical ) 15 and then would need to release 20 current players from scholarship.

Just wondering what their actual situation is… how many incoming and what hat would put the total at?

Comment by JLawrence 07.23.12 @ 11:42 am

The cult created Paterno. Paterno is dead but the cult still lives on.

Comment by TX Panther 07.23.12 @ 11:44 am

Glad I can go to Pitt at PSU and not see the statue. Maybe get a good seat as well.

One of my best friends is PSU fan and he is embarressed.

Not surprised if pre 1998 stuff comes out.

Comment by Frank 07.23.12 @ 11:50 am

The Big10 should have banned home television as that will turn into a media circus and trivialize this whole mess. More importantly, they will get air time which is often important with recruiting.

Scholarship limits are a crock. The one year scholly will be implemented to cut players off scholly that won’t contribute. See ohio state as an example. Two starters recently arrested, lose their summer only scholly. Back-up linebacker also arrested, booted off team, makes another open scholly. It’s a manipulation of scholarships and that wasn’t addressed.

Bowl ban should be for 5 years and schollies reduced for 5 years which would be one full recruiting cycle to change the culture. So I think the ncaa was “light” there. Vacated wins are stupid. Listen, when USC recruits, they still tell the recruits that they won the national title on the field and the recruits that drink the juice believe it. Same situation here, so although I think Joe got his in the “end”, pun intended, it’s not fatal to the program.

I expect them back in less than 5 years, but would prefer never to hear a story about them in the news at all. I am sure Smizik and Cook are figuring out how to spin this and to be candid, they should be in peril for their juice drinking stance on this, but only the public complaining, through boycott of a product will get that done.

Comment by dhuffdaddy 07.23.12 @ 11:59 am

@JLawrence…from the jargon I have read it looks like the 15 scholly per year limit begins with this current recruiting class (2013-2014 academic year), but the 65 max scholly begins NEXT year(2014-2015) academic year.

Basically they can sign 15 for this recruiting class, but need to make sure there are “cuts” the next year. Either a lot of people graduate/transfer/move-on or they won’t be able to recruit a 2014 class. Let’s look at the math (with some assumptions)

Assume PSU had 85 scholly players this year (2012-2013 academic year). Let’s say 25 graduate/transfer/move on leaves them with 60 players. The 2013 recruiting class signs 15 players moving them up to 75 (this is okay because the 65 doesn’t take effect until 2014 academic year). Now at the end of the year 25 more players leave the program leaving them with 50 players…if they sign another 15 in 2014 recruiting class they are at the 65 limit in time. Doesn’t look like it should be too hard for them to meet that.

Comment by BCPITT 07.23.12 @ 12:01 pm

dhuff…that makes sense as far as the 65 limit is concerned, but if they cannot offer more than 15 new scholarships per year they would have trouble filling those empty scholarships. Only way to get around that is to get a player to pay his own way as a walk on for a semester and then give him a scholarship. How many 4-5 star recruits want to deal with that? If they are willing to manipulate scholarships like that it wouldn’t leave me with a warm and fuzzy when they tell me “walk on one semester and then we promise a scholarship as soon as we can dump some RS soph who isn’t panning out”

Comment by BCPITT 07.23.12 @ 12:05 pm

I believe that for the most part, this is a fair punishment. When the question of punishment first came up, I said to anyone who would listen “death penalty, without a doubt.” However, after hearing the press conference today and reviewing the sanctions, I believe this to be far worse than the death penalty. This will have a more significant impact for a far greater period of time than the death penalty would have.

That being said, I am critical of one decision- that is, to not implement some sort of TV ban. In our society, scandals, whether right or wrong, make for “must see TV.” I firmly believe that ESPN/ABC will be clamoring to show Penn State games on TV, because they know that right now, Penn State is like a car wreck- you don’t want to look, but you can’t help yourself. Advertisers will pay premium dollars for those games, knowing fully well that people will tune in, just out of curiousity. I looked at their schedule this year, and per ESPN’s website, their first 3 games (Ohio, Virginia and Navy) are all scheduled to be broadcast on ESPN/ABC stations. They also have an 8pm game with Iowa, which you know will be televised by someone since it’s starting at 8pm. The networks will benefit from this and the team will benefit from this. So to me, they should have been banned from television for a period equal to their post-season ban (4 years).

Comment by hacky3 07.23.12 @ 12:43 pm

Advertisers need to boycott Penn State. That will take them off the air.

Comment by TX Panther 07.23.12 @ 12:55 pm

@BCPITT – thanks…had not paid attention to when the cuts began.

Comment by JLawrence 07.23.12 @ 1:01 pm

Wisconsin can finish third in the Leaders Division and be in the Big 10 Title game.

Comment by Mailman 07.23.12 @ 1:33 pm

The thing about all this that floors me, is that Penn State has never been renagade program like SMU or Miami. I thought the NCAA, in it’s eagerness for politicl correctness, absolutely hammered them. The NCAA looks the other way on way too many things to suddenly become the guardian of truth, integrety, and the academic interests of the students. I have a problem with them professing the high ground, they are more interested in protecting their image. That’s exactly the same motivation that let the Penn State administrators, not to call the authorities. This case needed to proceed through the court system, no matter how long it takes. The penalties handed out by the NCAA hurt the athletes and the fans, not the men who opted to cover things up.

Comment by Justinian 07.23.12 @ 5:56 pm

Justinian–The players are protected because they are free to transfer without loss of eligibility.

The term “fan” comes from fanatic. Fans are those who have a fanatical devotion to a favorite sports team. They choose to follow that team for recreation and for enjoyment. Their enjoyment typically is greater if the team they have chosen as the object of their devotion is winning.

Fans have no inherent right or entitlement to a winning team. PSU fans still will have a team even if it will not be as successful in the next few years and will not, as a result, give them as much pleasure. They weren’t and aren’t “entitled” to even that much in the grand scheme of things. No fan of any sports team is “entitled” to anything. Life and what really matters in life (and its not sports) will go on as before for PSU fans.

Comment by pitt1972 07.24.12 @ 12:28 am

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