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May 25, 2012

Earlier in the week, BC blog, Eagle in Atlanta wrote a really excellent post on how and why ESPN should step in to defuse the whole mess of FSU wanting to flee (with another ACC school in tow) to the Big 12. It lays out a great case as to why it is in ESPN’s interest to do so and draws parallels to the way ESPN worked to make sure Texas didn’t destroy the Big 12 by leaving for the Pac-10/12/16. He doesn’t, however, see ESPN showing any interest in taking this kind of action. Read the whole thing, it’s really good.

I do disagree with him, though, in drawing the parallels to Texas. In the case of Texas, they were considering the Pac-12 for more than simply money and football. It was about the alignment with schools in the west. It was academic interests in being part of the Pac-[random number here]. Ultimately, they opted to stay in the Big 12 because it positioned them better — with the help of ESPN — to control more. The money was a big carrot, no question. But it was also the easier path. No fights with the Texas legislature over what would happen to Baylor and Texas Tech.

The better comparison would be to the situation of Texas A&M.

Texas A&M going to the SEC was not simply for money. The reality is, that the TV money for the Big 12 (and thus, Texas A&M) would have been almost on par with the SEC by the time their deal got done if it still had Texas A&M and Mizzou as opposed to WVU and TCU. The actions by Texas A&M was much more about the long-building anger towards Texas controlling and dominating the Big 12. Not feeling respected. Essentially dictating to Texas A&M through the conference.

The creation of the Longhorn Network and ridiculous money was the final straw. The fans, boosters and power brokers had enough. The president and athletic director were removed from this decision.

Texas A&M wanted to assert its independence from the Longhorns. All of their grievances built up over 100 years would be addressed by breaking away from Texas and the Big 12. It sure wasn’t to get a competitive advantage to getting in the national championship picture. Having LSU, Alabama and Auburn just in their division makes that clear. It was about reaching a point where history, geography, and every other tie was nothing compared to the anger, frustration and all the negatives they felt towards Texas and the Big 12.

On its face, Florida State wanting out of the ACC seems to be about the money. That’s driving the justification, and a significant difference between Texas A&M and FSU. But this has become about so much more to FSU fans. It’s about getting out of a conference that favors the Carolina schools and the old blood. It’s about getting out of a basketball conference to a conference that shares their values — football. It’s about getting out of a conference that didn’t respect what they had accomplished and done for the conference. About getting out of a conference where they were lumped in as a punchline to college football in the present.

In short, I don’t think ESPN coming with more money would mollify the FSU mob. Nor would the ACC giving FSU more money do the trick.

Hell, VT could finally win a national championship. Clemson could stop being Clemson at the end of the season. Miami could return to top-ten status. FSU could return to prominence. The ACC could finally meet the expectations it and others expected for its football when it expanded in 2003. It might hold them for the short-term, but that’s it. It wouldn’t resolve the underlying anger. The perception has hardened into reality for most FSU fans. To them, the only solution is to leave the ACC.

The real problem for FSU. Getting the Big 12 to decide to have another expansion.

It seems inevitable that the B12 will eventually expand but with the B12 – SEC bowl game, it may be in less of a hurry. Less pieces of the pie to share the $$.

Comment by wbb 05.25.12 @ 12:48 pm

I still don’t quite understand the math of it all. For the Big 12 to add FSU and Clemson based on the rumored deal of 20 million per school, FSU and Clemson have to be worth 40 million extra per year to the TV networks just to maintain that level.

Also, if you read the blog of the WVU guy that started the rumors he had a post last week pleading FSU and Clemson fans to put pressure on the administrations even though his source at WVU is certain it is a done deal.

With all the being said, FSU fans hate the ACC more than Pitt fans ever hated the Big East. FSU fans seem to think that they will go back to winning national titles in the Big 12. But seriously, if you can’t win big in the very weak ACC football conference (FSU fans think it is really weak), then how the heck is FSU going to win big in the Big 12 where Oklahoma, Oklahoma St. and Texas are huge programs that win.

Comment by Wardapalooza 05.25.12 @ 1:22 pm

Its too bad FSU fans are totally delusional and in need of psychiatric attention.

Comment by pitt1972 05.25.12 @ 1:25 pm

College fball may be on its way to becoming the NASCAR of football a regional red state southern sport. A business model dominated by the south texas and oklahoma does not make good sense. Even the big 10 and pac 12 wil be left behind by the southern startegy. I can see all the playoff spots being monopolized by 2 conferences. This will make sport irrelevant to the major population centers only increasing nfl dominance in those areas. Also when will rest of nation sour on these 2nd rate schools and their quasi professional outlook

Comment by steve 05.25.12 @ 1:30 pm

Idont know what ESPN can do not abought FSU but abought the ACC just think abought this ESPN is the ACC so to speak if the acc becomes irrelevant
if it becomes worthless then ESPN will lose so for there own sake they need to prop up the acc do something to keep it relevant in football .
what i dont know give it a bigger tv contract the must make schools want to stay in the acc for there own reason becuse they bought it so to speak
and they will lose money if the acc goes down hill.

Comment by Frankcan 05.25.12 @ 1:36 pm

The really funny thing, when seeing what FSU and Clemson fans have to say is……

right after they are done talking about getting to the Big 12, almost everyone mentions in the next breath how well it will help their football program!!!

Ya, that, not only are they going to the Big 12 and getting all that Big 12 money, they will also be 10-2, 11-1, 12-0 every year!!!

Hell, they can’t do it now in the ACC. 20M?? Guess what, every other Big12 team is getting 20m too!

There is a real good chance, that either of these two could end up easily with 5-7, 6-6, 7-5 records regularly in the Big 12.

Only gimme wins would be Baylor, Iowa St. and Kansas. And really, are they even gimme’s on any given Saturday??

Comment by Dan 05.25.12 @ 1:36 pm

FSU peeps don’t want to realize, they are never going to be the team they were in the 1980’s (where they played anyone anywhere) or the 1990’s. Bowden was in his heyday and FSU & Miami had pretty much control of the treasured Florida recruits as UF wasn’t much in the 1980’s and didn’t get their act up to snuff until Spurrier arrived in 1990.

They associate their demise with their entry into the ACC. Which is pure lunacy, as they entered the ACC in 1991 and played for several national championships in the mid 90’s, getting trounced by the above mentioned Spurriers UF team in 1996.

Nope their demise was much like Ped State’s. Their successes had created monsters for head coach’s that despite the game having passed them both by, couldn’t be removed. As these two monsters had become more powerful then even their University presidents and only a pedophile scandal could remove one(albeit kicking and screaming) and the other was slowly forced out(again kicking and screaming), as both their programs slid downhill.

Which reminds me of a saying. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Comment by Emel 05.25.12 @ 1:47 pm


Iowa State is no pushover anymore. As they upset, Texas in 2010 and who can forget their dramatic win over #2 Oklahoma State last year which kept OK, State out of the National Championship game.

No Paul Rhoads is making the ISU Cyclones a pushover no more. And I suspect Charlie Weiss will do the same at Kansas. As Mangino proved you actually CAN win at Kansas.

FSU and even more so Clemson would have a pretty difficult time in the Big 12, as will the hoopies.

Comment by Emel 05.25.12 @ 1:57 pm

Texas wanted to add their Longhorn Network, which was the last straw for Texas A&M. I don’t blame them. They wanted no part of a conference that would agree to give one member special consideration and treatment. Texas being able to negotiate it own TV deal gives them an unfair advantage over the other teams. It’s like the deal Notre Dame had with the Big East, they got take advantage of the benefits that being in the Big East Conference offered and were able to have their own TV deal, keeping all their football money. When you change the rules that apply to everyone else to accomodate one member, you’re going to have problems. The Big East also had all the inequities with the Basketball schools keeping the conference from properly addressing the football issues.

Comment by Justinian 05.25.12 @ 4:10 pm

Hey Mel!! How are ya?? Hope all is well.

Ya, even I’ve just about had enough.

Hate to lose either one of them or others, but, nothing you can do.

Don’t let the door hit you. Add UCONN and Louisville (their spot at the Big 12 trough may be taken) and have some enjoyable football for footballs sake and a hoops conference for the ages.

Can’t say I won’t be bitter though, and enjoy seeing anyone that leaves getting pushed around.

(no, I don’t equate it to us leaving the BE, that was the Titanic going down, the ACC has been one of the most stable conferences there has been)

Hey, if you’re gonna go, go ahead and go already for cryin’ out loud!!

Comment by Dan 05.25.12 @ 4:11 pm

Turning now to the school that Pitt is..

link to

Comment by steve1 05.25.12 @ 6:02 pm

link to

Comment by PantherP 05.25.12 @ 6:36 pm

Great news about Ziegler. Back to Football. link to

Comment by Atlanta Panther 05.25.12 @ 7:34 pm

Zeigler what great news we should be tough this comeing season at last some good news.

Comment by Frankcan 05.25.12 @ 7:34 pm

But my point abought football we are espn espn is the acc they have us till what 2027 so if the acc goes down hill they lose money.
so they better step up and help the acc keep football relevent i dont know how maybe more money but if the acc goes down espn goes down they brodcast all the games so they need us to be good
so they need to help.

Comment by Frankcan 05.25.12 @ 7:41 pm

I don’t understand why FSU would want to play Baylor, Isu, ksu, Kansas, tcu, wvu, Texas tech. Thats a lot of undesirable games.

Comment by Steve 05.25.12 @ 7:42 pm

Nothing in college football would surprise me anymore. Looking back not too many years ago, Virginia Tech, Boston College, Miami were in the Big East.

Comment by Justinian 05.25.12 @ 8:50 pm

Danny, what a hockey game.

Comment by steve1 05.25.12 @ 10:08 pm

Feigler news is great! Now let’s hope our football transfer QB Savage can play this year!

Comment by dish 05.25.12 @ 10:23 pm


Comment by steve1 05.25.12 @ 10:50 pm

What academic interests would be enticing to UT joining the Pac 12? There aren’t any.

Comment by Ryan 05.26.12 @ 12:12 pm

Frankcan–check out the Swofford interview with the Clemson folks posted on the lair and Scout and rest a little easier.

Also remember the B12 deal will go to 2025 and also be backloaded so 2027 isn’t much different.

Comment by pitt1972 05.26.12 @ 8:32 pm

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