To just simplify all stories regarding Bill Stull for the rest of the year. The theme is redemption. The obligatory aspect is that Stull was booed in the opening game.
As Pitt fans, we may be tired of the storyline. We may feel it has been beaten into the ground. We may feel that it is being overplayed and exaggerated. That’s irrelevant. This is the story and by god it will be run into the ground by each and every sportswriter that chooses to write about Stull at some point.
So Kevin Gorman, freshly minted Trib. columnist after his stint as Pitt football beat writer gets his Stull redemption story a little later than most in Western Pennsylvania.
“I’ve kind of become immune to it,” Stull said. “I know if I let that get in my head, if I let that sink into my heart and, most important, if I start buying into what these people are saying, then I can’t play the type of football that I know how to play, that I’ve been taught how to play.”
What Stull can’t help but notice is how the negativity has affected his family. The cascade of catcalls has prompted his parents, Bill and Debbie, to leave their seats and watch games from a rotunda at Heinz Field this season.
Bill Stull Sr. has been so bothered by the booing that he left the Backyard Brawl last year at halftime – after his son threw an interception in the end zone – and walked home to Mt. Washington. He left the Connecticut game Oct. 10 for the same reason, watching the fourth quarter at Bettis Grille 36.
This is the conflict. We can and as fans do split the hairs over whether the boos are directed at the players, coaches and/or playcalling. Parents from their perspective see it as being directed at their kids.
As a fan, I don’t recall much of the booing from the Backyard Brawl being directed at Stull so much as the poor playcalling and the overall ineffectiveness of the offense.
The UConn game was a small surge, but then drowned out by support and cheers. As a parent, though, I can understand the feelings.
Gorman does get Stull and his father on record to talk a little about their feelings regarding it. It’s more candid than done so far.
The piece ultimately fails because Gorman does this in a way that is sure to make Pitt fans defensive about the whole thing rather than willing to think critically about it. All because he preceeded that part with this.
For this, Pitt fans should be embarrassed. To his credit, Stull blocked out the boo birds to become one of the feel-good stories of college football.
Gorman’s bio notes that he is now teaching a sportswriting class at Pitt. Hopefully he focuses on the fact that everything you write gets preserved. As pointed out, Gorman while still a beat writer in training camp was quite honest in writing that Stull hardly looked like he had earned the starting job.
Now, Stull has a 9-4 record in 13 starts. Bostick is 4-4 in eight starts, including victories at West Virginia and Notre Dame. Sunseri has yet to take a snap in a college game, but has the best arm of the bunch. Even so, Stull is the starter, even if he didn’t shine the way a fifth-year senior should.
“Has Billy made the big strides? I would say probably no. But has Billy performed at the level that you would say he’s the starter? I would say yes. I’m just trying to be as honest about it as I can,” Wannstedt said. “He’s got 13 starts under his belt, so he’s our starting quarterback. I feel good about the other guys; I feel good about Billy. I think our quarterback position as a whole is better now than it’s been the past couple years, that’s for sure.”
Stull, however, is going to have to prove that he’s the quarterback of the first nine games of the 2008 season, not the final four. He’s going to have to put the Sun Bowl behind him – and fast.
Now to right a piece that comes off as self-righteous and that Pitt fans should be ashamed of themselves for some vocalizing their feelings over Stull’s performance while ignoring that he wrote about his own doubts from watching in training camp (and yes, I get that since the piece is a news column and doesn’t necessarily allow for expanding on that –but then he still has his blog to do that) makes it seem a tad hypocritical. Heck even Ron Cook has managed to admit he was wrong in between the single sentence paragraphs.
What’s really interesting in light of the Stull stories, is this from the Paul Zeise’s chat today.
Frankie_CigsPack: Can you give us some insight as to what the team thought of Bill Stull at the beginning of the season to where they see him now? It’s a great story in college football this year without a doubt.
Paul Zeise: Yes, a lot of the team wanted Tino to be the guy because they didn’t have much faith in Stull. Now, if you talk to them, most of these guys would run through a wall for Bill because he’s earned their respect, not just as a good quarterback but as a tough guy who is a leader and who wants to prove he is a winner. Respect and confidence from your teammates are two things you must earn and Stull has certainly done that.
So coming out of training camp, even the Pitt players didn’t have faith in Stull. And not just because of the Sun Bowl.
We can go round and round over the booing. The fact is, that Stull has turned things around and stands to change his legacy at Pitt with the way the season goes.
He’s done a lot to this point. Hopefully he keeps it going.
Saying that Stull didn’t shine as a fifth year senior in camp is reporting a fact, which he backed up with quotes from the head coach, and not a critical personal opinion.
As to the subject at hand which is the treatment of Bill Stull by the fans, most PITT fans don’t get the depth of it. It wasn’t just the boos that are involved here. If it were limited to an instance or two of booing the kid I’d agree that it isn’t worth discussing at this point. But it is the relentless and personally insulting treatment the young man got from January 1st until a few weeks ago.
The crude catcalls from the stands as referenced in Gorman’s article was one aspect of it, but it was also the vile and over the top criticisms and insults on the PITT message boards that stick in my mind. You know these players read that stuff and have to be affected by it one way or another. And I know for a fact some parents of the PITT players read it also.
And yes, it was embarrassing to have sat in the stands when Stull was being booed and it was embarrassing to hear and read all those beyond the bounds things said about Stull… and Gorman was correct when he opined that the fans themselves should be embarrassed.
While the support for Stull has been exemplary over the last few home games, we all have to live with what had happened early in the year .. just as Gorman has to be responsible for everything he wrote. Maybe there is a lesson here.
Pitt has put itself in a position to win the BE and get a BCS bowl bid – can we perhaps get excited about what may come?
Pitt has put itself in a position to win the BE and get a BCS bowl bid – can we perhaps get excited about what may come?
Here we have a top 20 team coming off a Top 10 basketball season. Name another school with that distinction. You can’t. And we can’t get 40,000 to a football game?
It’s a damn shame.
So it’s time to unleash a Primanti Scheme (get it?). I’m inviting all of you to the Syracuse game. Each of you invites one other, who invites another and so forth. We’ll fill the seats.
Who’s in? C’mon, you so called “loyal sons/daughters”…
Why WOULDN’T you be a beat writer in Pittsburgh if you were a good one? Where would you rather go, a city like Miami or San Jose or wherever where nobody cares? There isn’t a team in this town that doesn’t have a huge die-hard following. That means lots of readers.
There hasn’t been that much booing since the first game (mostly pent up Sun Bowl frustration), and when it does occur, it is well deserved (bad passes, interceptions, etc.). We pay for these seats, we can boo if we want. Just like we cheer when Stull throws a touchdown to a wide open receiver that a 10 year old could hit – we cheer anyway, even if his contribution to the play was no big deal.
It does appear that Stull is improving, sure. But his numbers do not reflect his actual game performance. He has excellent receivers who he is is able to hit when they are wide open (thanks to them), although often behind them or on the wrong side of their body. Often times the height of the receivers vis-a-vis the short corners that cover them lets them jump and turn a bad pass into a big play. Stull has had a lot of time to throw this year, thanks to his o-line finally performing – that makes even a mediocre QB look better. He has a solid running game to keep defenses from focusing on the pass.
Still, let’s give him credit, since Stull is getting better, making fewer mistakes, and taking advantage of the talent at his disposal. It does appear that the end of the NC State game (mercifully, an away game) has been put behind him.
“It’s not fair to pin all the blame on quarterback Bill Stull. He was running for his life most plays, got knocked down a ton and even hurt his wrist. The biggest factor was that Pitt played without left tackle Jason Pinkston, who had a shoulder injury. Oregon State’s defensive line absolutely decimated the Pittsburgh offensive front, which had been a strength of the team most of the season.Then there was a snapping wind that made throwing long patterns difficult, if not impossible, for both teams.
Still, Stull had been very shaky down the stretch this season, and he didn’t have a strong enough arm to combat the wind. Why offensive coordinator Matt Cavanaugh didn’t call more short passes or over-the-middle routes is a mystery to me. The long fades to Jonathan Baldwin had no chance of working.”
———-
The fact is there was much criticism of Cavanaugh immediately after the bowl, and we were all relieved when he moved on to the NY Jets. Yet, the closer we got away from that bowl, it became ALL Stull’s fault 24/7 … to the point where the antichrist was going to be booed the very first slip-up of the season. I hope you’re all happy!
I am not trying to justify the booing. I didn’t boo, but I understand it. Stull hardly looked impressive at the start of the season.
Between the way he ended the 2008 season, the Sun Bowl, training camp reports of little change, and a feeling that there was never a truly open competition at QB — there was a lot bubbling under the surface.
I was trying to point out how attacking Pitt fans for the booing is not going to be an effective way to persuade or encourage critical thinking about the issues — especially the effect of booing on parents of the kids in the stands.
Every now and again, I get e-mails from some of the parents. It is a great honor and serves to reinforce my feelings about where the line is in criticizing and even complimenting the kids.
As for the message board stuff. No, there is no excuse. It’s despicable and disgusts me. I don’t do it on this blog and I hope it is generally discouraged in the comments.
The, last I checked, though, that aspect was not even included or discussed in the article so do not try to make that part of what Gorman wrote.
Patrick, wow, you just trivialized pretty much everything a quarterback is asked to do. Make the throw when he has time, hit receivers when open, put the ball where only the receiver can get it to take advantage of their height, and make defenses pay for selling out to stop the run. What else do you really, honestly expect a college quarterback to do? Throw 8 TDs a game? Never, ever throw a pick? Take the oppositions’ cheerleaders home with him after the game?
Some people just won’t ever let up. That’s what I can’t stand about this town. If you’re a Pitt fan, you should be kissing Stull’s feet for not blowing this season like it looked like he was capable of doing based on his play prior to this year.
Stull looks great now. But, in the Spring and Summer camps, he and all the other QB’s were running for their lives. Now, all of a sudden, very few sacks, great runs, tons of time in the pocket.
Maybe, just maybe, the reason he and the offense looks so great is because the O-Line got their hats handed to them for 6 months, and got immensely better?
Great start though… HTP!
About time somebody chimed in with some sense. Players don’t change 180 degrees in 10 months, but sometimes results do, and you have to look at all the surrounding factors to try and understand the kind of disparity we’re seeing in Stull 08 and Stull 09.
Of course Stull was dealing with some challenges last year. The line hadn’t jelled, his roommate and favorite target was playing the wrong position and his offensive coordinator stunk. But teams were stacking the run against him and McCoy and he still wasn’t able to do ANYTHING.
Nobody expected him to be a star last year; they just didn’t expect him to be abominable. And that’s what he was…..abominable. Like crazy bad.
This year the line’s playing well, he’s got a couple favorite targets and the offensive coordinator is a huge improvement.
Does anybody seriously think he’s a great QB? Does anybody seriously think he’s even a good QB?
Let’s talk about this in December, when we know something.
But I do think that all the talent Wannstedt has accumulated is finally paying off and he can beat people with a Stull playing QB, which is a great milestone for the program.
Hats off to Wanny for his hire of Cignetti and Cignetti for changing Stull’s life and performance. A good CEO makes good hires and Wanny has made a great one in Cignetti. A lot of football to be played, but hats off to Wanny, Cignetti and Stull from one of the boo birds!
It’s really simple actually.
Count me as one who thinks he is a good QB, a very good QB.
Just note that you seem to base on everything on the fact that he does not have a strong arm. If that is such an important criterion, please explain why Jamarcus Russell and Kyle Bollar are not perennial all-pros .. when in fact they might be the two worse?
Further, off the top of my head, two weak-armed QBs has lead teams to national titles this decade (2000 & 2002), and there may be more.
All this negativity has got me down. Let’s all unite, hold hands and rejoice in WVU’s failure. (See above video)
Something about the Bulls is just a bad matchup for WVU.
You have a point there Patrick. This is America. You can choose to be a pereson without class.
Hugh Green: ” Does anybody seriously think he’s even a good QB?”
Hugh, seriously. Have you actually watched any of the games or is your ability to assess football skills just simply challenged?
People booed, so what. Stull is better when he is not running for his life, big surprise.
This is a good football team. I get the feeling that some on this site would rather see Stull fail to prove they were right about him. Why not be happy that he is way better than most thought and that the O-line has allowed everyone on offense to excel.
Did anyone think that the offense would be better than the defense?
If the defensive backfield continues to jell this team can run the table. Dare to be positive. Dare to be Great.
HbgF, McD QB M Johnson certainly looks like a stud, especially for a junior .. maybe Shady can work on him for going to Pitt.
I think Billy has learned to eat this negative BS for breakfast and is feeding off it at this point. Hail to Pitt! Show them what you got Stull!
Hugh Green’s comment, “Let’s talk about this in December, when we know something” begs to question, what makes you think you’ll know anything in Dec, Mr. Green? I’m not sure that even 4 straight Pitt wins will provide enough momentum to extract your head from your ass, it might be hopeless.
that unlike Hugh and Patrick, I am going to dare to actually enjoy this team …
sorry to disappoint and appear so naive to the cunics.
Well, maybe that’s the situation right now, but Hugh Green hasn’t yet submitted his position paper to the Davey O’Brien Award Committee that begins with the premise: “Bill Stull is not even a good QB.” Wait until the committee analyzes the documentation that HG is going to submit in support of his premise.
Also, I agree with some of you that the booing and negative press angered Stull and pushed him to play better.
Because of this, I say we take it to the next level. First incompletion in the Syracuse game, someone throw a hot dog at him. Then find his parents and berate them until they decide to walk back up to Mt. Washington. This will REALLY piss him off, which in turn will propel him to a national championship, Heisman, 1st pick in the draft, and first NFL rookie to win Super Bowl MVP.
The times have really passed me by. In my day, the instructions would have been, “Attend your Friday classes, hit the library, and try to catch up on your homework assignments if you are behind in any of them.”
Chas where is my t-shirt?
A sign of an excellent team: 12th man isn’t needed.
My money is on ND being moved to prime time 8:00PM. We’ll see…
Pitt is now ranked 14 in both AP & Coaches, while Cincy is 4th & 7th. USF is 26 th in both.
1. Taylor will probably replace McGhee in the starting lineup soon.
2. Adams didn’t look all that good (just one game). Also, he seemed to play shooting guard exclusively.
3. Gibbs and Woodall seem to have Dixon’s trust right now. The game was under 10 points late, and they, along with Robinson, Wannamaker and Taylor were on the floor. Woodall looked like the best point guard in terms of running the offense, but he has a long way to go.
4. There is a lot of talent on this team, but it is not clear how it is going to fit together. They could really use Gil Brown, mainly because he has experience playing in important situations. This team is going to have to scratch out wins this year.
5. The defense has to get better if this team is going to be successful this year. Effort was not an issue today, but the game seemed to move a bit fast for several players. Hopefully, that will change as they gain experience.
4.
Remember guys, McGhee is a Junior and JD always likes to start upperclassmen as a unwritten rule. My guess is McGhee’s ability to stay in the starting lineup will be based on the following:
1) Taylor’s development at the 5
2) Miller’s development at the 4
3) McGhee’s defense (or lack thereof)
4) McGhee’s Foul Trouble
5) McGhee’s WTF moments (Missing dunks and putbacks)
I’ll never forget the night McGhee starting in place of Blair last year (I think it was Belmont)… McGhee boned a sure dunk. I’ve never seen JD so pissed in all of my watching him. JD has little patience for WTF moments; especially, from upperclassmen.
Miller has a nice looking shot (hit a three), but looked a little slow in terms of defensive positioning. Again, it looked like the game was moving just a little fast for him. As I mentioned before, this seemed like a common theme. I think this is understandable given the lack of experience, and playing time will probably flow to the guys who are able to adjust on the speed of the game on the defensive side.
I agree that Robinson is a bit small for a PF, but he plays hard and rebounds, so I think he’ll get chances to play early in the year. I wonder if Brown will be playing some at the 4 when he comes back – not his natural position, but they could use a little more size and experience on the inside.
I also agree that we are going to see lots of experimentation with player combinations. That being said, I think it was telling that when the game was still on the line with 2-3 minutes to play, Dixon stayed with Woodall/Gibbs/Wannamaker/Robinson/Taylor. Still, lots of time for things to change…
But Gorman isn’t being a hypocrite or even contradictory, because he wasn’t the one booing Stull. Also, what he printed earlier was pretty much fact–he said Stull hadn’t shined during training camp compared to the other QBs and he listed what he would have to do to keep his starting job. There is no trace of opinion in that assessment at all.
There’s a difference between having doubts about someone, which Gorman may or may not have had since he never actually printed that in the above quotes, and booing them, which he definitely did not do. Gorman’s column is simply pointedly honest and I’m sure his editor is extremely happy with the job he did on it. And I’m far from a Gorman apologist–I hate the Trib and subscribe to the P-G.
I like your blog a lot, but I feel you’re off-base on this one.