masthead.jpg

switchconcepts.com, U3dpdGNo-a25, DIRECT rubiconproject.com, 14766, RESELLER pubmatic.com, 30666, RESELLER, 5d62403b186f2ace appnexus.com, 1117, RESELLER thetradedesk.com, switchconcepts, RESELLER taboola.com, switchconceptopenrtb, RESELLER bidswitch.com, switchconcepts, RESELLER contextweb.com, 560031, RESELLER amazon-adsystem.com, 3160, RESELLER crimtan.com, switch, RESELLER quantcast.com, switchconcepts , RESELLER rhythmone.com, 1934627955, RESELLER ssphwy.com, switchconcepts, RESELLER emxdgt.com, 59, RESELLER appnexus.com, 1356, RESELLER sovrn.com, 96786, RESELLER, fafdf38b16bf6b2b indexexchange.com, 180008, RESELLER nativeads.com, 52853, RESELLER theagency.com, 1058, RESELLER google.com, pub-3515913239267445, DIRECT, f08c47fec0942fa0
April 16, 2007

Breaking news: Pitt and Penn State fans dislike one another. I’ve sometimes heard over the last few years that it’s a “dead rivalry” and that a ton of people don’t really care. Personally, I’ve always wanted to see the annual football game make a return and things I’ve read this week have opened my eyes to see that I’m not the only one and there is still bad blood. It’s too bad this is all being played out by fans and not players on the field, but it’s still happening whether you’re for the return of the game (100% of the Pitt fans and half of the PSU fans) or not (the other 50% of the PSU fans).

The first time in a while that I really started to think about the rivalry was with this post on Mondesi’s House. It wasn’t actually the post as much as the comments, where Adam (a convicted PSU homer) had this to say in response to “Things That Annoy You About Sports”.

Pitt fans who think Penn State is afraid of them. Honestly, Penn State doesn’t need Pitt to generate buzz. There will be 105,000 asses in seats to watch TEMPLE. So c’mon, admit you need us, and admit that Joe was right in going to the Big 10 and move on. Come to Beaver Stadium twice to every one time we go to Pitt and everything will be ok. Otherwise, quit taking pot shots at JoePa on natinal television on what is supposed to be your biggest rivalry game (on a Thursday night no less, can anyone take that seriously?). And remember, your sour grapes go no furthur east than maybe Johnstown. No one else cares the Pitt doesnt play Penn State. We are busy winning.

Oh, the fire was definitely started with that. I’ll save his very first comment of Pitt fans thinking PSU is afraid of us for later in this post. The rest is easy to pick apart though.

It is more than easy enough to cram that many people in a stadium a few times a month for four months when you live in the middle of no where. This is Happy Valley, not New York City. There is nothing to do in central Pennsylvania other than count down the days to the next Penn State home game. Let’s look at that in comparison to the city of Pittsburgh, where on any given Saturday there are many more choices of things to do instead of see a college football game. I’m not saying the Pitt’s excuse for low attendance, but saying how great Penn State’s attendance is in comparison to our’s is absurd.

Adam also makes a great point — in favor of the Panthers. I forget where I read this, but someone made the point that Penn State is a state school, while the University of Pittsburgh represents a city.

Population of Pittsburgh and surrounding metro areas: 2,358,695
Population of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania: 12,281,054

So tell me, which is easier to draw fans?

Ending his comment saying, “We are busy winning” had to have been made by someone who very recently jumped on the Penn State bandwagon. Obviously someone has forgotten that PSU’s record from 2000-2003 was 22-26. Busy winning, indeed.

But wait, this all extends into basketball too.

As for the basketball team, did you notice PSU isnt on the Pitt schedule this year? why? because last year we didnt have a losng record. 15-15. Apparantly thats too goo a record for Jamie Dixon to deal with. as soon as we become remotely competitive, we are taken off the schedule. funny dont you think?

Yes, Adam, because Dixon is the guy who has total control of the schedule. I also wasn’t aware that schedules were made after each season. Oh wait, they’re not. Too bad that 15-15 record was a fluke; this year’s PSU hoops record was 11-19 with all of 2 wins in the Big Ten.

That’s just one little fan though, albeit one uninformed fan. The debate was brought up yet again at Mondesi’s House with this post. More of the same babble going on — it all died down for a while though.

Then I gave you a story from Penn State’s student newspaper, The Daily Collegian. Many of the comments were what you’d expect: anti-Penn State, calling Paterno names, and all around hatred toward Happy Valley. I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t thinking some of the exact same things some people wrote. We had one brave State fan who naturally went with the name “JoePa”.

And Nick, if it’s Penn State’s loss that the alleged rivalry not be renewed, why does this issue eat at Pitt fans so much? –JoePa

I don’t know, JoePa, if the story appeared in “The Daily Collegian” then there must be a fair number of PSU fans that care a little. –Nick in State College

Not the first time Mr. Paterno has been wrong. I think that’s why some Penn State fans aren’t quick to want to see this rivalry start back up. Paterno is looked to as a god by PSU fans, and if a god doesn’t want to see this game get played then neither will his followers. Those followers are also the same ones who called for him to retire after the 2004 season, saying things like, “He’s too old!” I guess he’s not too old to ruin a great rivalry though.

A few days later, that post was then relayed to the masses over at the AOL Fanhouse by Brian Grummell. Grummell says maybe Penn State should join the Big East or go Independent, and while even I can agree with PSU fans that they won’t go Independent, they have nothing special going for them in the Big Ten. No one considers them a real rival while they’d like to think they have something going with Ohio State and Michigan State.

Penn State fans always say how they don’t care about Pitt when they need to take a look at themselves first. Ohio State is too busy playing in the most important games of the decade against Michigan to consider PSU even a mini-rival. Just because you play Michigan State for trophy doesn’t mean that constitutes a rivalry either. In Big Ten basketball, Penn State is dirt.

Meanwhile, Pitt has a solid group of rivals. Sure, West Virginia has beaten us up the last couple years but that doesn’t automatically take away it’s rivalry status, at least judging by the “conversations” that Pitt and WVU fans had during last year’s Backyard Brawl. In basketball, we’re building rivalry games with teams like Marquette, UConn, and a WVU team lead by Bob Huggins.

The last place where we saw this come up in the last week was Black Shoe Diaries. Other than taking a shot at some of our commenters (” Well hey, Pitt fans. At least you’ll always have your dignity.”), there wasn’t anything too special in the post. One thing that did stand out to me was that PSU shouldn’t leave the Big Ten because of “the opportunity to be highly ranked and in the running for the BCS every two or three years.” Well if you guys are as good as you think and the Big East is as bad as you’d have everyone think then wouldn’t you be able to come over here and go undefeated, be ranked Top 10 all the time, and earn the BCS bid every year?

The comments were full of great stuff though. There were a few Pitt fans who comment here that made their point over there.

Now listen, I can’t argue with the results we’ve seen from the last few Pitt football teams. I also don’t consider Pitt to be a top college football program right now and I’m not sure if they’ll ever get over the hump into that top group. I’m have realistic enough thoughts to see this. I do, however, think that sometimes Penn State fans, while they’re busy putting our program down, over-inflate their own program. Remember when the author over there said the Lions were “in the running for the BCS every two or three years.” I’ll let Stuart take it form there.

If by “in the running for the BCS every two or three years,” you mean you’ve made 1 BCS bowl game EVER, then yes, you are in the running. Every 2-3 years would mean you’ve been in 3 to 5 by now. I’m sure math is not a strong suit for you.

That’s not even close to the best comment I saw though. In response to a Pitt fan’s remark, we get this gem.

“So, until you actually win a game against us this decade IN ANY SPORT, remember you are winless against Pitt and will be for the foreseeable future.”

Before you go spouting off maybe you should look first – I prefer wrestling over basketball any day of the week.

Wrestling
PSU-Pittsburgh W 26-19 2005
PSU-Pittsburgh W 28-15 2004

So how many million people out there filled out there brackets for this year’s basketball tournament? How about this year’s wresting tournament? How much money was wagered on each? I laughed out loud when I read that.

Penn State always tries to make excuses about how they don’t care about their basketball team, but this has to be the worst one I’ve heard. At least say you’d rather spend your money on making that stupid ice cream rather than trying to convince us more people care about college wrestling then hoops.

Anyways, remember when Adam said Penn State isn’t afraid of us in that Mondesi’s House post?

A commenter at the Penn State blog gave us the exact reason Paterno won’t schedule us.

The bottom line is we don’t need this rivalry. We’ll get our guaranteed win elsewhere.

It would be horrible to lose a team like Pitt, wouldn’t it? Penn State fans will call us a second tier program, however they know it’s not out of the question that we could be them. How do you avoid that? Don’t play them.

I don’t want to talk money, TV deals, or any of that garbage. In the end, Penn State and Pitt can both live without playing this game. I want to see this game for the fans, for rivalry, for tradition, and for history. By the way, the next time someone tells you a Pitt-Penn State rivalry is dead or doesn’t exist, have them read this post. Have them read the mud slinging that goes on at varioud blogs and websites. Have them recall the last time they didn’t root against any PSU team in any PSU sport (or vice versa for you Happy Valley folks) and then have them tell you it’s dead.





Unfortunately, Greg, that is the way that PSU students view the world. Trust me, I’m a PSU student and all that they care about is getting drunk on weekends and using football games as an excuse to get drunk. I actually try to get involved with the community, and I am often berated and criticized for it by other PSU students. It is truly pathetic

Comment by Nick in State College 04.20.07 @ 1:57 pm

“Andy,

So football is more important than academics or community! If that’s the way Penn Staters feel, I’m glad that I went to Pitt. Wake up and join the real world!”

Of course not. Im saying state college does not compare itself culterally to Pittsburgh because theres no reason to. Besides were talking football here and that what PSU considers when talking about ther series. Not Pittsburgh’s culture. Trust me nobody is impressed by Pittsburgh’s culture. Let alone state college.

Comment by andy 04.20.07 @ 3:52 pm

“Andy,

So football is more important than academics or community! If that’s the way Penn Staters feel, I’m glad that I went to Pitt. Wake up and join the real world!”

Of course not. Im saying state college does not compare itself culterally to Pittsburgh because theres no reason to. Besides were talking football here and that what PSU considers when talking about ther series. Not Pittsburgh’s culture. Trust me nobody is impressed by Pittsburgh’s culture. Let alone state college.

Andy, don’t be late for your Fertilizer class.
I admire your posts for their crude simplicity, but you need to learn some HTML tags,.. hick.

Pitt fans, how come all of our rivals happen to be mouthbreathin’ yokels?!?!

Comment by ChrisA 04.20.07 @ 5:17 pm

Andy, Please don’t try to tell me about State College vs. Pittsburgh when it comes to culture. I live in State College and the only kind of culture here begins with the letters “agri”–

Comment by Greg 04.20.07 @ 7:02 pm

Caught this link from Mondesi’s site and thought I’d throw in my 2 cents, having grown up in Pittsburgh and being one of the “old generation” being a kid always looking forward to the Pitt-PSU game in the 70’s and 80’s. It was THE game on the east coast (before Miami, Florida, Florida St., and the Big 10 becoming part of the mix of powerhouses spotlighted on TV and national rankings). A few points from my humble perspective:

1. The fans and players of both schools would get up for this rivalry regardless of who is a better football school and better people and all the nonsense being argued (anyone ever hear about Tennessee vs. Vanderbilt, Oklahoma vs. Nebraska, I could go on, but basically Tennessee kicks the crap out of Vandy most years, but it is still the biggest game for BOTH schools every year). Whether Pitt won 10 in a row vs. PSU or is down a particular year, or if PSU is 10-0 or 0-10 that year, or has beaten Pitt 10 straight times, is irrelevant. “We can lose all our other games, but we don’t lose to Pitt (PSU)” would be the rallying cry. Why? Both schools couldn’t stand to lose to the other for the simple fact that the players and students will always have a large percentage coming from PA (and particularly, Pittsburgh). You can’t tell me that a kid from the ‘Burgh who went to PSU wants to come home for the Holidays and hear about Pitt beating them. Parents of kids from both schools would be energized again. The geographic proximity and the history makes it something that will make the players care – many of the players played with or against each other in High School. Anyone remember LeVarr Arrington’s comments after he blocked the field goal attempt to beat Pitt? Anyone see how Pitt played their most inspired game that year? In summary, I believe it would again be a knock-down, drag-out fight that both players and fans would love to hate and hate to love on both sides (regardless of what is being said now). I do believe that Penn State is in a better conference, but even if that is true, who wants to get beat by their little brother. What little brother doesn’t wanna kick his big brother’s ass for being arrogant and thinking he’s better? And, yes, Pitt vs. WVU or PSU vs OSU or Michigan are great games, but there are many good arguments why those just aren’t the same nor will they ever be. Notre Dame, OSU, or Michigan will NEVER consider PSU to be their #1 rivalry, regardless of the venom PSU has for those schools.

2. All of point 1 is basically moot in my humble opinion due to $$ and recruiting. If college football was geared to please the fans, then there would be a playoff system in place, not the ridiculous bowl concept. ‘Nuff said. Thus, it seems that PSU has the most to lose by staging the game due to $$ and recruiting impacts of playing Pitt vice some patsy or out of area powerhouse. What would you do given these options:
A) beat up on Temple (a more guaranteed win) and get them to do a 2 for 1
B) play a traditional power (Notre Dame) from out of area and get national attention and potentially bolster recruiting from that area.
C) Play a local team that has a hard-on for you and would like nothing better than to whoop you every year (and has the potential to do it a few or many times) that is geographically the most dangerous recruiting competition.
Picking C just doesn’t make good business sense. Yes, wake up, college football is a business – a HUGE ONE! It pays for all the other Penn State sports programs and affords the football teams luxury practice facilities and training table and ….. Back in the old days, it was ok for PSU to fight it out to be the “beast of the east” for the Western Pennsylvania talent because the area wasn’t being raided by the Big 10 like it is now (due in large part to PSU joining the conference) and recruiting wasn’t the national battle it is now. So… arguments of being scared and whose football program is relevant or better or who are better people and which school will save the world are not really the issue – as always, it comes down to $$$ and the fans lose.

Thanks for reading,
Duder

Comment by black n gold duder 04.24.07 @ 1:13 am

River City Rivalry? I think that speaks for itself who is more desperate for a rivalry. It’s freakin’ Cincinatti, come on.

kkells

Comment by kkells 05.16.07 @ 5:14 pm

Hey, do this newcomer a favor and let’s revisit the main topic, why Pitt and PSU didn’t join an all eastern conference. I actually thought it was Paterno’s fault because he wanted too many home games or something like that. But it actually seems that Pitt being at fault for the failure of a Pitt/PSU eastern conference has been conceded. What’s up?

As for the rest of the comments, it seems like Pitt is winning (yes, I am a Pitt fan). The Big 10 isn’t very good in Bowl Games, Pitt is in the Top 10 in football National Championships, and the Big East has the same # of football National Championships’s as the Big 10 does since the creation of the Big East (is that true???). Pitt won the last game against PSU 12-0. Heck, Pitt’s even smarter than PSU. But yes, the Big 10 does have more fans (can’t really understand that).

Anyway, let’s hear about how Paterno sabotaged the eastern league some more.

Comment by EJL 07.03.07 @ 9:45 am

[…] So yeah. I’m tired of the Pitt-Penn State thing for this calendar year. Unless they actually draw up a contract, I think we’ve gone deep enough into the issue (especially in this post). Until anything is made official (probably shortly after Paterno is buried), we’ll get this type of thing. Yesterday, Paterno was asked during his weekly news conference if he would be in favor of playing Pitt on a six-and-four basis — six home games for the Nittany Lions and four away — over a 10-year period. […]


Even though I’m a Penn State fan, I would rather see Penn State and WVU renew the rivalry. And living in Ohio now, people in Columbus don’t like the fact that OSU only has won 2 games in State College, you can correct me, i don’t care. I do root for Pitt in basketball, unless they’re playing Kent State, which I’ve noticed Pitt doesn’t do well against.

Comment by Kent Stater 03.16.08 @ 1:25 am

Powered by WordPress © PittBlather.com

Site Meter